e36 325 competitive?

[EkstenRacing]

I'm considering building an e36 325 2.5 liter for ITS. Any idea how competitive i can expect it to be. I've heard that the intake restrictor they make them run really slows them down. Would you be better off running it in ITR?

Thanks

[Greg Amy]

E36's were extremely "competitive" in ITS, thus the restrictor. And, I suggest they're the car to beat in ITR right now, at least until/unless someone does full-up development on other options. Plus, it's all been figured out, so for you it's a plug-n-play (or, well, buy-and-install...)

But, given that the only build difference between the classes is the restrictor and a little weight, run both classes and decide for yourself...

[lateapex911]

But, given that the only build difference between the classes is the restrictor and a little weight, run both classes and decide for yourself...

Well, not exactly, Greg. As you remember, allowable wheel size is 8.5" wide in ITR, (and it's 7" in ITS) so a different wheel/tire package is part of the winning package. And, of course, that could mean different springs, dampers and sway bars, etc.

[Greg Amy]

Thank you, Jake, for providing yet another good example of why wheel width restrictions in Improved Touring are silly...

;)

[dj10]

E36's were extremely "competitive" in ITS, thus the restrictor. And, I suggest they're the car to beat in ITR right now, at least until/unless someone does full-up development on other options. Plus, it's all been figured out, so for you it's a plug-n-play (or, well, buy-and-install...)

But, given that the only build difference between the classes is the restrictor and a little weight, run both classes and decide for yourself...


What he said.........+1

[RedMisted]

What Greg said is very true about the 325 in ITR. And it seems that just about every other car in your division (NEDiv) is a 325...

[rthiele]

Why would you build a car when there is a couple of good and proven ITS/ITR cars out there? It's a buyer market.

There is not much data as of yet, but if I'd build a full-blown ITR car from scratch, I would consider other options as well, not just the E36 325.

[JeffYoung]

Nor has anyone built, to my knowledge, a to the max, restricted ITS 325. Given how much of an overdog they were unrestricted, restricted they may do just fine.

[lateapex911]

Why would you build a car when there is a couple of good and proven ITS/ITR cars out there? It's a buyer market.

There is not much data as of yet, but if I'd build a full-blown ITR car from scratch, I would consider other options as well, not just the E36 325.


Such as???

[rthiele]

E36 328, E46, Z4, Porsche 968. For sure there is other brands and models as well with good potential.

As I said there is not a lot of data on ITR cars, but it is worth considering all the options rather than just following the cow path of former ITS cars.

[lateapex911]

I agree! I just wanted to see what folks might be thinking...

[rthiele]

I am curious what the Flatout guys will end up building for 2010. Did you make up your mind yet, Andy?

[chuck baader]

I have been told that there are those that have figured out the restricter and have their "S" cars almost as fast as before. Were I going "S", that is the way I would go, being a BMW guy, and all that. I think the open ECU rule has helped quite a bit. Chuck

[JeffYoung]

Chuck, I'd like to see the E36 come back to ITS with reasonable HP levels. Do you know who has done this (figured out the restrictor)?

[73itb]

[quote=rthiele;290308]Why would you build a car when there is a couple of good and proven ITS/ITR cars out there? It's a buyer market.

http://www.racingjunk.com/category/84/Improved_Touring/post/1543331/1992-BMW-325is-SCCA-ITR.html

[rthiele]

The D.Maynard and E.Tisdale ITS/ITR cars are also on the market, not for that price though, at least last time I've seen the ads

[Andy Bettencourt]

I am curious what the Flatout guys will end up building for 2010. Did you make up your mind yet, Andy?

*I* have...

[specialtyautomo]

I have the KVS e36. I have run it with the restrictor in BMW and PBOC along with a few test days. I have Chets 240z to compare lap times with. I have run a 145.2 at Barbers this past march with the BMW club with the restrictor on 15 inch wheels. I have a chipped dme and have also run a custom AEM ecu also. They can be competitive, the power is pretty dull and flat. The restrictor turns the e36 into more of a momentum car than a power car. The handling stinks compared to my zcars but it does have great brakes. If you can learn how to drive them as a momentum car they can be competitive. A much better fit in ITR with out the restrictor. With out the vin rule change control arms and motor and make a 328? The restrictor makes improvements from tuning with the vanos pretty much useless.

Bobby Bitterman

[specialtyautomo]

Another note. Chasis dyno comparing the 240 with sunbelt power to the e36 the restrictor needs to be at 31 or 32 mm to give the same power to weight ratio. There are alot of 240z out there with over 180hp at the wheels. I did use a different restrictor than the Raetech for the best result. The GCR defines what the restrictor must be and for how long. I dont buy into the theory that the restrictor has to bee as far from the intake valves as possible

Bobby Bitterman

[GKR_17]

If you find a fast ITS E36 check under the hood. I've heard of a few who just didn't bother with the restrictor. I don't believe tech ever checked ours, and they certainly didn't do the stall test.

[dj10]

If you find a fast ITS E36 check under the hood. I've heard of a few who just didn't bother with the restrictor. I don't believe tech ever checked ours, and they certainly didn't do the stall test.

Not true, when I raced ITS w/ restrictor, SCCA Tech made me open my hood and show them the SIR...I broke the track record with it @ Mid Ohio, with medocare suspension.

[ulfelder]

*I* have...


I am curious what the Flatout guys will end up building for 2010. Did you make up your mind yet, Andy?

I plan to be in ITR next year. :happy204:We've got a pretty good idea what we're building - but things may change as we keep doing research. I'll say this much: there's a chance the Land of the Rising Sun will do battle with Deutschland.

Steve Ulfelder
Flatout Motorsports
05 ITS

[ed325its]

The D.Maynard and E.Tisdale ITS/ITR cars are also on the market, not for that price though, at least last time I've seen the ads

Rob, Thanks for the bump. My car is still available and listed here in the for sale forum and I am accepting reasonable offers. Seriously considering retirement from racing, at least for a couple of years.