Sentra SE-R

[Brettt]

Hello, I just found a link to your website on a thread in the SCCA forums. I'm totally new to driving a car on the track, but I've been following and bleeding road racing for as long as I can remember. I've got a 93 Sentra SE-R, which I understand fits into ITA. I've wanted to prep and race it since I got it back in about 02, but I just recently got another car and the money to turn the sentra into a track-worthy machine. I've been to a number of events at my local track just to watch, but now I want to drive.

I guess my biggest question is this: I know what the physical limitations on what kind of suspension I can run, but I have no idea what kinds of spring rates and shocks people with this car run. Also, I'd heard that it's hard to be competitive in ITA with stock or close to stock engine. Any insights you guys have would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

[Knestis]

Welcome to the wars. :)

The answer to the "How much does it cost?" question is always, "How competitive do you want to be?"

A stock engine isn't going to get someone to the front of a competitive ITA field but for someone just starting out, the learning curve will be steep enough that power isn't the biggest concern.

You'll hear this a lot but I'll be the first to say it: If you can find something already built, you will save a LOT of money over building exactly the same car yourself. This is particularly the case right now, with the economy making it a buyers' market for race cars.

There's some people here who can give you guidance on the spring rate question but before you get to that level of detail, do some shopping around and see what you can find on the used market.

K

[tnord]

"competitiveness" varies by region also, where are you located?

[Racerlinn]

Brettt, they go from mild to wild. Specific to springs, I'm a budget racer (mid-pack) and I run OEM style after market springs that are 350#. On the other end of the spectrum are SE-R guys running 800-1000# coilovers. Likewise, I'm running a stock junkyard engine, while others have full IT built (0.40 over) motors. Speed costs money, how fast do you want to go?
A good BASIC resource would be www.sr20forum.com/forum (http://www.sr20forum.com/forum) Stick within the Race subforum and you can ask some good questions and get some good answers, but don't believe everything you hear. But it's a good starting resource for the car.

[Brettt]

tnord-
I am located just south of Omaha, Nebraska, about 3 hours north of Topeka. I've been going to Heartland Park for drag races since I was a little kid and I always thought the road course looked way more fun.

Racerlinn-
I'm definitely on a budget for the beginning here. I know people have said that I can save a lot of money and headache by getting a pre-built car, but this car is a project my dad and I are doing. He's built his own race cars for years and this is going to be a fun project to start out. We're going to build our own exhaust, intake, strut tower braces and other little stuff like that because he owns an auto body repair shop. (lucked out there) Basically, what I'm saying is things like fabrication aren't going to really be a problem.
-I've already ordered some hyper-flex bushings for the car, and my next move is to buy the suspension. I have the money saved up, but now it's time to make the choice. If you have any suggestions as far a brands on springs and shocks I think that might be the most helpful. I'm still trying to figure out what people out racing actually use.

Thanks for the help guys!

[Brettt]

I guess my "home track" would be MidAmerica Motorplex, since that's an SCCA track and it's about 20 minutes from my place.

[pballance]

Welcome to the fray,

Brettt, for what it is worth, if you are building the car yourself, you need to become very familiar with the GCR. You can find it online at www.scca.org (http://www.scca.org). Be sure to prep your car to the correct ruleset.

IMHO, you should spend your efforts in building a safe car, ie good cage and safety gear, then suspension, and then engine. If you get the safety things out of the way then you can concentrate on getting used to racing while tweaking the suspension. Then you are ready to spend some $$$ on an engine.

You might want to take a look at Dave Gran's book, "Go ahead, take the wheel." It will help you out a lot.

Good luck and welcome

[tnord]

Brett -

I run at MAM quite frequently, live in Kansas City, and have an ITA car as well. I hope to see you often this year. Do you have plans as to how you're getting your liscense yet? Did you know there is a double school at MAM in April where you could complete your liscensing requirements and even run a race on sunday?

with a couple exceptions, ITA cars in MiDiv don't have near the prep level that some other areas of the country do. even if you do nothing but intake and exhaust work, you'll probably have more power than anyone else in the division, and certainly enough to be "in the mix." If I were you I would make sure to get a good cage in the car first, then focus on suspension, and lastly engine. If your funds are somewhat limited, you can skip the motor stuff for this year and spend it on track time.

I'm not sure what shocks/struts the nissan guys are using, but Eibach Race Springs are pretty standard across all makes/models. As far as what spring rates to go with, i would lean more towards the softer side that Steve Linn was suggesting rather than the really high rate 1000lb+ stuff. The higher rates may ultimately be faster with the right driver, but the softer springs should be easier to handle for a new driver.

if you have any questions about what you need to do to get started, the liscensing procedure, or anything else, i'm happy to help.

[email protected]

PS - some of us are planning on a test day at MAM in mid/late march to shake down the cars before the season starts up. if you want, i can keep you in the loop of when we'll be there if you'd like to join in.

[cjb25hs]

tnord-
I am located just south of Omaha, Nebraska, about 3 hours north of Topeka. I've been going to Heartland Park for drag races since I was a little kid and I always thought the road course looked way more fun.

Racerlinn-
I'm definitely on a budget for the beginning here. I know people have said that I can save a lot of money and headache by getting a pre-built car, but this car is a project my dad and I are doing. He's built his own race cars for years and this is going to be a fun project to start out. We're going to build our own exhaust, intake, strut tower braces and other little stuff like that because he owns an auto body repair shop. (lucked out there) Basically, what I'm saying is things like fabrication aren't going to really be a problem.
-I've already ordered some hyper-flex bushings for the car, and my next move is to buy the suspension. I have the money saved up, but now it's time to make the choice. If you have any suggestions as far a brands on springs and shocks I think that might be the most helpful. I'm still trying to figure out what people out racing actually use.

Thanks for the help guys!

Not a nissan guy here but I would suggest Koni Sports with Ground Control sleeve kit. You can get a package deal on shox.com for about $965 bucks. That way you always have the flexibility of going double adjustable and different valving based on spring rates when you get there. As far as spring rate I have no idea. Kinda depends on what tracks you are going to run the most at. I would stay pretty conservative say 350-400F and 250-300R with an adjustable big rear bar.

[Greg Amy]

I know what the physical limitations on what kind of suspension I can run, but I have no idea what kinds of spring rates and shocks people with this car run.
You've opened a large can of tasty worms. Bottom line: the car can be competitive. This car will be all about engine, a drivetrain to put that pwoer down, and an attempt to build a suspension to keep it on the track.

I don't have a lot of time right now, but:

- Build the best engine you can. We developed one to 155 whp (Dynapack), and there may be more left with better tuning.

- Suspension is completely limited by your pocketbook. You need high spring rates, and spring rates are limited by what you can spend on shocks. Forget KYB AGXs, they're crap. Next step up is Koni Reds inserted into stock tubes, probably good for ~300-400# springs. Jump up to revalved Koni 8611s in custom tubes (~$2500) and you're good to about 1000#. What you really want is Koni 2817s so you can actually CONTROL those springs, but now you're talking $6000+.

- You've got a big problem with the LSD. The factory viscous won't cut it, and no one is making any aftermarket LSDs for the car any more. If you can find a used Quaife or used NisMo clutch-type LSD (I prefer the latter) jump on it. Otherwise you'll never be able to put that needed power to the ground.

- I can point you to a JDM-spec 4.437:1 final drive. You'll want that, too.

- The chassis is a flexible-flyer. Without a good rollcage you'll never be able to keep the chassis straight and use those new high-buck shocks.

Yup, it's nationally competitive, but it takes work and time. Or you can just enjoy the heck out of it locally.

GA

[Racerlinn]

Greg's given a road map of the "high road". My low road budget map:
Koni red insert's - not that hard to build your own struts, go here:
http://www.sr20forum.com/chassis-suspension/185484-custom-shortened-koni-info-discussion.html
I run OEM style Road Magnet springs:
http://www.sr20forum.com/group-buys/189333-road-magnet-springs-round-2-b13-b14.html
Hyperco "2" springs are also out there. These are your low buck entries. I stuck with those due to cost as well as the fact I already had Cusco camber plates to work with them.
There are lots of suspensions constantly being sold in the classifieds on the SR20 forum. You can usually find a deal.
As I said earlier, I run a stock motor, it's a 50k mile junkyard motor (I blew up my original 138k mile motor last year with a missed shift).
I run only the OEM LSD. As Greg said, you can't put the power down as early.
Build up your own intake with a big "pop charger" style filter.
And as they all said, make sure you work on the cage first. It was easily my biggest expense on my low budget build.
I run mid-pack at the big events in GLDiv, but can also run at the pointy end of weaker fields in both GL and MidDiv. There's almost always someone to race with, that's what I want and am happy with.

[tnord]

Brett -

Don't worry about it, I bet there's only one car in this division making over 130whp. There's also another guy down in Lawrence KS running an ITA Nissan NX-2000. I forget his name though.

[Greg Amy]

Actually, Travis, I seem to recall our mid-miles junkyard engine was making 135 'packs with external bolt-ons (header, intake) and the stock ECU on pump gas (in fact, I won the '06 ARRC with a stock ECU...:shrug:) - GA

[tnord]

Actually, Travis, I seem to recall our mid-miles junkyard engine was making 135 'packs with external bolt-ons (header, intake) and the stock ECU on pump gas (in fact, I won the '06 ARRC with a stock ECU...:shrug:) - GA

which would mean he'll be plenty fine in this division with a stock powerplant + bolt ons for his first year.

[Andy Bettencourt]

I have seen plenty of bolt-on'd and Wolf-ecu'd SR20's making 140 Jets. As has been stated, you will have plenty of power to run at the front, even with just bolt ons on this car. Getting her to handle and stop is where you (IMHO) should focus your development efforts.

[shwah]

If you or your dad are well versed in welding, you can make the cheapest nsd (no slip differential) there is.

Just weld it up.:eclipsee_steering:

[tnord]

There's also another guy down in Lawrence KS running an ITA Nissan NX-2000. I forget his name though.


Michael Pearson......that's the guy with the NX-2000. Greg I think he said he spoke with you about the car a couple years back, i think it was an old SSB car.

[Greg Amy]

Michael Pearson......that's the guy with the NX-2000. Greg I think he said he spoke with you about the car a couple years back, i think it was an old SSB car.
Yup, I've been in contact with Mike over the last couple of years, been offering him recommendations. He bought my Advance Design shocks/suspension parts from me... - GA

[Brettt]

Thanks for all the advice guys. I think I'm gonna put the cage in and get new suspension first off. The cage I pretty much have figured out, but I'm not sure about the suspension. I found a group buy on some Ksport coilovers on the sr20forums, but I haven't found a lot of info on that brand. Basically my budget for suspension is about 1000, so what do you think my biggest bang for that amount would be?

Travis- I would love to tag along to your shakedown sessions. My car might be stock still, but it would be fun to go around the track. Let me know when you're planning on going- [email protected]

[Brettt]

I almost forgot- how do I make this thing stop? The last time I took this around midamerica, the pedal was almost gone by the third lap. I feel like this is something I should be considering when building this car. Any suggestions there?

[tnord]

Brett -

I'll let you know what we end up doing, hopefully it works out. For brakes, what pads were you using? Hawk Blues are generaly a good place to start and go from there.

[Brettt]

I was using some sort of OEM replacement pads. You're saying that good pads is the first step then? What about braided brake lines? Do those make a noticeable difference?

edit:Also, is it normally hard to find my car on the application chart for Hawk blues?

[xr4racer]

Good pads and especially good racing brake fluid or at least fresh Ford High Temp. The brakelines are probably junk as well and braided will give you a harder pedal because your brake pressure will actually be going to stop the car and not first expanding old rubber lines

matt

[Racerlinn]

Brett, for the AD18 brake, there are not a lot of pad options. I use the Carbotech XP10, available direct from Carbotech for about $155. Yes, change out the rubber lines to steel braid - should be less than $100. I also run brake ducts to the front calipers. And use the good brake fluid with regular flush and fills (I do it after every weekend). You can still brun the front brakes down easily - just need to learn to drive them smart and only pound on them when you really have to. If you stand on them every corner, yeah, they are going to go away.

[tnord]

you're not kidding Steve.....i spent maybe 30min looking for SE-R pads and came up with squat.

Hawk......nothing.
Cobalt.....nothing.
PFC........nothing.
Porterfield.......nothing.

is carbotech REALLY the only option? i used them once, and as a general rule amongst miata drivers is if you don't bed them in properly they will burn down in a weekend or two.

[Racerlinn]

Porterfield makes (or made?) one. Didn't like them the one time I tried them a couple years ago.
And yes, bedding is certainly important.

[JLawton]

Do the SE-R's use the same calipers as the NX2000? I actually use a caliper that's almost identical to the NX. And surprise, surprise, you can't find performance pads for a Saturn either.......... BUT it takes the same pad as a Eclipse and a couple of those types of cars. I have to do a little grinding on the outside of the backing plate but works well.

[Greg Amy]

Do the SE-R's use the same calipers as the NX2000?
No.

[Miata49]

you're not kidding Steve.....i spent maybe 30min looking for SE-R pads and came up with squat.

Hawk......nothing.
Cobalt.....nothing.
PFC........nothing.
Porterfield.......nothing.

is carbotech REALLY the only option? i used them once, and as a general rule amongst miata drivers is if you don't bed them in properly they will burn down in a weekend or two.

I've been running a couple of different compounds from Porterfield. Just call them up and they can give you some suggestions.

[Racerlinn]

I've been running a couple of different compounds from Porterfield. Just call them up and they can give you some suggestions.

Steve, what kind of cost on the Porters?

[c_ozzie]

I'm using the raybestos st 43 pads.these are expensive. I like them better than the porterfield compounds.
best to call them for pricing.

#12 ita se-r

[Miata49]

I think the last ones I got from them were around $180 for the front. They were the Raybestos. The Porterfields were the same price. I've tried the AP 511 R-4 and the R-4 E enduro pads as well. I hated the enduro pads. They wore very fast. The regular R-4 was better but the Raybestos pads I bought last time were much better than either of the Porterfields.

[c_ozzie]

wondering if if anyone experiences fuel starvation when you get to about a 1/4 tank, especially when making right hand turns.
Without going to a fuel cell is there a fix for this??

[Racerlinn]

wondering if if anyone experiences fuel starvation when you get to about a 1/4 tank, especially when making right hand turns.
Without going to a fuel cell is there a fix for this??

Yep. Always have.
My solution has been to make sure I don't go under 1/4 tank. :)

[Greg Amy]

Yep. Always have.
How much fuel does it take to fill up from that point of starvation? Reason I ask, I never had a problem with the NX2000. However, I didn't use the factory gauge, I had a Stack system installed. The way I calibrated the gauge was to turn on the pump and empty the tank until it started to spit, then called that "zero". From there I'd add a gallon at a time to calibrate it to full (which came to about 10.5 gallons).

So, you can probably do the same thing: pump out fuel until it starts to spit, then note that on the gauge and call it "zero". - GA

[timrogers]

wondering if if anyone experiences fuel starvation when you get to about a 1/4 tank, especially when making right hand turns.
Without going to a fuel cell is there a fix for this??

You might want to look at the return line that goes back into the fuel tank from the fuel rail. It should empty into the well in which the fuel pump sits but often the hose degrades or gets dislodged and the fuel goes to the main section of the tank instead.

[Brettt]

Okay! All of the comments have been really helpful. We're actually starting the tear down process THIS weekend. After that's done with, we start on the cage.
-Do any of you B13 guys have any picture of the cage in your cars so we can get some ideas?

-For suspension, I was thinking of going with ksport coilover-type shocks with 448# front/ 336# rear. Do those sound like pretty good rates for a starting point?

A lot of other stuff will fall into place later, but we basically are trying to get this all in to make it legal so I can get my license this season. As always, comments/ideas are much appreciated!

-Thanks

[Brettt]

link to suspension- http://ksportusa.com/asp/coilovers_detail.asp?product_id=cd06

[cjb25hs]

link to suspension- http://ksportusa.com/asp/coilovers_detail.asp?product_id=cd06

From what I have heard and read, run as far away as possible from those. They are not going to last. You would be better off with koni's, kyb's, tokico whatever you can get with some gc conversions.

[Greg Amy]

Do any of you B13 guys have any picture of the cage in your cars so we can get some ideas?
At the risk of sounding non-humble - but trust me, it's purely because I'm lazy - feel free to spend some time at the below link(s). There's a lot of rollcage pics in there somewhere...

http://www.kakashiracing.com/news.html

[Racerlinn]

How much fuel does it take to fill up from that point of starvation? Reason I ask, I never had a problem with the NX2000. However, I didn't use the factory gauge, I had a Stack system installed. The way I calibrated the gauge was to turn on the pump and empty the tank until it started to spit, then called that "zero". From there I'd add a gallon at a time to calibrate it to full (which came to about 10.5 gallons).

So, you can probably do the same thing: pump out fuel until it starts to spit, then note that on the gauge and call it "zero". - GA

Heehee. That would be assuming I have ever even messed with the tank and pump. I've never even taken the access cover off. :happy204:
I'm within 20 lbs of minimum weight with a 1/4 tank of gas (before it starves) so I've never considered messing with it.

[Racerlinn]

Okay! All of the comments have been really helpful. We're actually starting the tear down process THIS weekend. After that's done with, we start on the cage.
-Do any of you B13 guys have any picture of the cage in your cars so we can get some ideas?

-For suspension, I was thinking of going with ksport coilover-type shocks with 448# front/ 336# rear. Do those sound like pretty good rates for a starting point?

A lot of other stuff will fall into place later, but we basically are trying to get this all in to make it legal so I can get my license this season. As always, comments/ideas are much appreciated!

-Thanks

Very basic design I started with:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v366/Racerlinn/Cageleft1.jpg


Sorry, I don't know anything about KSports. I'm running cheap Koni inserts and cheap Road Magnets.

[quadzjr]

For what it is worth, I have heard nothing but bad stuff about the Ksports/D2 coil overs. They run super high rebound rates and and compresssion rates feel like water. Also the older models tend to blow and gettign them fixed under there warantee was easier said than done, but this is all hearsay. I looked into them as an option for the MK1 MR2 chasis. Since I can't seem to find an off the shelf racing only shock for the car.

[AE86ITA]

How would you guys rank the Progress(Mike Kojima) Competition Coilovers for the B13?

Thanks,

[c_ozzie]

I had the anual tech done for my car and I was told I need a fuel test port.... Well not sure where to put it or what it would look like. If anyone has a pic of where they put it on the se-r please post.

[Racerlinn]

Paul Morrison sold them, but the www.fuelports.com (http://www.fuelports.com) site is down. But this one works: http://www.angelfire.com/oh5/sccafuelports/page2.html
I believe I paid less than $30. Plumb it in-line in the engine bay just after/above the fuel filter. Easy install and access point. Safety wire it up real nice so the hoses do not pull off.
Looks like this: http://www.angelfire.com/oh5/sccafuelports/page2.html

[c_ozzie]

Paul Morrison sold them, but the www.fuelports.com (http://www.fuelports.com) site is down. But this one works: http://www.angelfire.com/oh5/sccafuelports/page2.html
I believe I paid less than $30. Plumb it in-line in the engine bay just after/above the fuel filter. Easy install and access point. Safety wire it up real nice so the hoses do not pull off.
Looks like this: http://www.angelfire.com/oh5/sccafuelports/page2.html

thanks!
$30... I'll be able to pass this by my accountant (aka wife) with no problem.:happy204:

[AE86ITA]

Greg:
Have you had a chance to compare your suspension setup against the Progress? If so How do they stand to yours and which setup would you consider "The Best Bang for the Buck"

Thanks,

[Greg Amy]

Have you had a chance to compare your suspension setup against the Progress?
Negative, no experience with the Progress system. Actually, I'm aware of them, but have no knowledge of their design.

Here's the key, though: for many years, I'd been harping on the need for more spring for these cars. Many, many people told me in the early days that 400-450# springs were more than enough. Through experimentation and engineering, we found that due to the limitations of the suspension design (read: struts with bad geometry) that the more spring we ran, the better (following the Colin Chapman axiom of "a suspension works best when you don't let it"). The sole limitation to performance in this car, then, became the shocks' ability to control the springs (assuming, of course, you've got the cage to stiffen the chassis). Eventually others have come around to where even the original doubters now agree the more spring, the better (though the Koni guys still think I'm bonkers...;) ).

I've run Koni Red inserts, KYB AGX struts, Advanced Design struts, then Koni 8611 inserts in custom struts. Then I even had those 8611s revalved for more. The better the shocks got, the more spring I could run, and the faster the car went. Had I a larger budget, I'd be buying those $1500 per corner Koni 2817s...

Bottom line: whoever you call, ask them if they "guarantee" that their dampers can support at least 1000+ in-lb springs, and if they do, how long they'll last. If they say "go" then fine. If they express doubts or horror or try to tell you that you won't need that, then walk away.

GA

[c_ozzie]

Paul Morrison sold them, but the www.fuelports.com (http://www.fuelports.com) site is down. But this one works: http://www.angelfire.com/oh5/sccafuelports/page2.html
I believe I paid less than $30. Plumb it in-line in the engine bay just after/above the fuel filter. Easy install and access point. Safety wire it up real nice so the hoses do not pull off.
Looks like this: http://www.angelfire.com/oh5/sccafuelports/page2.html

Steve did you use the 5/16 (8mm) serrated t connector?

[Brettt]

UPDATE: The car is empty! What I mean by this is we have started on the cage! I took the seats, carpet, spare tire, seatbelts, and headliner out of the car this weekend. We've already taken measurements and designed the cage as well. We're just ordering the tubing today and then when I get my 5 days off work starting thursday, the fabrication begins.

We did run into an interesting situation with the forward-most cage supports, though. The situation is this: in order to put the bars where we want and vertical, it looks like we would need to go through the dash. This means that dash modification/removal is in the cards. The problem is that I can't find anything about the dash in the GCR. Will we need to just remove the dash, fit it around the tubes, then replace it? Or do we need to bend the tubes around the dash? I know it is most likely in the GCR somewhere, but I can't for the life of me find it.

I've left messages with both the Nebraska SCCA director and the office in Topeka, so I'm hoping to hear back from them, but you guys rock and I thought you might be able to help either quicker or have more specific information about this problem.

Greg- We used the pictures of the welded-in cage you guys did for a lot of reference, but we just weren't sure about this dash thing. What I'm trying to say is thank you for all the awesome help. Racecar blogs rule!

[cjb25hs]

We did run into an interesting situation with the forward-most cage supports, though. The situation is this: in order to put the bars where we want and vertical, it looks like we would need to go through the dash. This means that dash modification/removal is in the cards. The problem is that I can't find anything about the dash in the GCR. Will we need to just remove the dash, fit it around the tubes, then replace it? Or do we need to bend the tubes around the dash? I know it is most likely in the GCR somewhere, but I can't for the life of me find it.


It is legal to go thru the dash. Just do what you need to to be able to reinstall the dash around the tubing. It is common practice, nothing to worry about.

[ramoncito89]

The progress group set up seems to be a good for the money entry level coil over I have no complaints over my setup since progress group can built a set to whatever the specification you need, since I’m racing a 2250 pounds b13 the spring weigh on front is 375 and 250 rear anything heavier than that will send the sentra flying all over the place I remember when I first ordered mine the costumer service guy who actually help mike on the design of the coilover told me to use a weight of 450 at front and 350 rear but it was too much when I first tested the springs on the race track the car was just too tight and never came to have a good grip so I ordered some springs from eibach at 375 F and 250 R and problem solved ,I know there are many konis with adjustability than can give a lot better performance than what I have but for 1000 bucks for more than an average coilover I think its fair what progress offer to costumers.

[tnord]

Brett -

Great to hear about progress being made and another ITA racer joining us in MiDiv. Do you think you'll be able to make the double school at MAM April 17th-18th?

[Greg Amy]

Brett, it's my pleasure. If you have any questions, feel free to PM me and I'll send you my email address for more info. - GA

[Racerlinn]

Steve did you use the 5/16 (8mm) serrated t connector?

Ozzie, I BELIEVE I used the 5/16 - I think that's the stock fuel line size. I don't have any of the documentation for it at hand.

Brett, great to hear you are making progress. Keep everyone up to date, post some pics too!

[Brettt]

UPDATE: I haven't worked since Wednesday. In a perfect world, there would now be the better part of a roll cage in the sentra. Unfortunately, the people who were supposed to have the DOM tubing seemingly forgot to call us back, meaning that we don't have anything to build it with. On the plus side, I have spent the last three days replacing all of the bushings on the car. I hear that some people do this with not much more than hammer and I find that quite impressive. I had a pretty rough time at my dad's shop with a torch and a press and impact wrenches. Have any of you guys swapped your bushings out with hammers? Some of those things were ridiculous.

Anyway... We're still waiting on the tube, but I have lots of other stuff to work on like tearing down the rear calipers and removing the sticky e-brake cables, not to mention removing the cat. and bending the exhaust out in front of the wheel. :D There's a swap meet tomorrow morning I'm going to in hopes of finding a cheap seat or some other unexpected amazing deal. Wish me luck!

[Brettt]

I'll get some pics up as soon as I find the USB cable for my phone.

[Racerlinn]

Original bushings = hammers, shims, anvils, torches, fire, fire, fire!! Yes, they are a pain.
Did you break the 12" long bolts on the rears?

[Brettt]

Actually, even though those were a huge pain, I managed to ruin none of them. I came close on the driver's side, but I only ruined the last few threads trying to get it out. The passenger side went much smoother, as I had figured out that i could just remove the whole piece and then get the middle of the bushings off with giant pliers after it glows red.

I'm hoping to get suspension and brakes figured out today, especially since it's my last day off for a while. We'll just have to see if I can continue to accomplish the seemingly impossible task of getting this car ready for novice school on April 18th.... :o

[tnord]

I'm hoping to get suspension and brakes figured out today, especially since it's my last day off for a while. We'll just have to see if I can continue to accomplish the seemingly impossible task of getting this car ready for novice school on April 18th.... :o

get the required safety stuff done first, worry about the go-fast stuff later. trust me, the car won't be "done" in time for the 18th, it can only be "done enough." a race car is always a work in progress, so don't get too caught up in the whole "i have to have this, that, and the other done before the school."

[Brettt]

Good point, Travis. Are you guys going to be at MAM at the end of this month? My dad assures me that the cage won't be a problem for time, so that's why I may seem like I'm not worried about it. As far as the rest of the safety stuff, (belts, fire suit, helmet, window net, etc.) it's either accounted for or already owned, so I have that goin for me.

I was surprised to find out that even though my dad is a drag racer who used to race dirt modifieds, he still knows about a half dozen people around here who do SCCA stuff, including one guy who runs a GT1 Camaro. Now THAT was a cool car to go look at! We've gotten a lot of good advice(starting with you guys) and it looks like we're going to have everything in order for the most part.

I found 4 used tires at the swap meet that I paid $20 for ($5/tire), but they look to be mostly used up. Do you guys have any advice/contacts on getting more tires?

Thanks!

[tnord]

I doubt I'll be able to make it with the car, but I might be there just for fun.

I have a bunch of old tires in my basement, but it's all mismatched stuff. I think I have 3 good Toyo RA-1s, 2 Kumho victoracers that are pretty much dead, 2 Hoosier 05s, and maybe a couple other randoms. you're welcome to whatever you want if you come down to KC to get it, or I can bring it to the school if I go (hoping I will).

[Brettt]

Travis- does that mean free? I can definitely take a sunday and come down to KC the week after next if that works for you.

[email protected] - let me know what you think

[Brettt]

oh. I guess the tire size might be important. Are they 205s? 225s? 15in?

[tnord]

oh yeah, 205/15/15. if you want them, come get them. i'd be happy to donate some old tires to help a new guy get started.

[Brettt]

well consider them sold, sir. I'll let you know for sure when I can be down to get them in the next few days. I really appreciate the generosity!

[xkaupx]

I am looking to get into IT in the future, but it is very unlikely I could be ready for this season. I don't have a car yet, or enough money to alleviate that issue at the mo. I would very much like to attend the meet up at MAM if you do have one though. It would be nice to meet everyone and get a good idea of how to proceed so maybe I can be ready for next year.

[tnord]

Brett -

I'll be out of town the weekend of the 28th, but otherwise should be available whenever you want to come down.

Xkaupx -
you should come to the school at MAM, i'd be happy to talk racing with you and how you can get started. it might cost less than you think :) email me any questions you have or if you're going to come down to MAM. [email protected]

[xkaupx]

Thanks tnord, I would like to go to that class. I know there are some really good deals right now on cars and equipment, but I am starting from scratch. I need a trailer, car, helmet, etc. Also I have to get my tow vehicle ready. There are quite a few things I need to get in order and I just recently got into this so I haven't had a chance to save up for it. :(

[tnord]

if you've got an evo, i bet you could have a truck/trailer/car for whatever you sold that thing for. there are some good cars out there for sale for less than those fancy street car suspensions. :D

[xkaupx]

Heh, you're right there, they can get quite expensive. I don't plan on buying any suspension upgrades or anything major for it though. It is my daily driver so mostly stock (some bolt-ons). If I knew about IT before I got it I probably would have waited. Now that I have it though I don't think I could give it up. :D

[Lael Cleland]

Hi Brettt, I talked to my man dave in CO. and they still have cheeper AMB mafiasponders....I dont know what cheeper is yet? get some sleep!

[EV]

UPDATE: I haven't worked since Wednesday. In a perfect world, there would now be the better part of a roll cage in the sentra. Unfortunately, the people who were supposed to have the DOM tubing seemingly forgot to call us back, meaning that we don't have anything to build it with. On the plus side, I have spent the last three days replacing all of the bushings on the car. I hear that some people do this with not much more than hammer and I find that quite impressive. I had a pretty rough time at my dad's shop with a torch and a press and impact wrenches. Have any of you guys swapped your bushings out with hammers? Some of those things were ridiculous.

Anyway... We're still waiting on the tube, but I have lots of other stuff to work on like tearing down the rear calipers and removing the sticky e-brake cables, not to mention removing the cat. and bending the exhaust out in front of the wheel. :D There's a swap meet tomorrow morning I'm going to in hopes of finding a cheap seat or some other unexpected amazing deal. Wish me luck!

Have you considered going with a Kirk products cage? They come mostly made, bars notched out, and ready to weld in. http://www.kirkracing.com/

[Thekid29]

Trying to get a 91 Sentra on track before the summer is over. The cage is nearly complete with some additional bars to be added on the drivers side as marked with the black tape. It started with a roll bar only and now the cage is being completed. The suspension is done. I ended up using Koni 8610's with GC coilovers and camber plates. The addition of rear spherical ball upper strut mounts made a huge difference in handling.

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[Pirita]

super nice shoots!!!!!! nice car too!!!

[Pirita]

please post some exterior shots too!!!

[Thekid29]

The cage is getting painted now. Some exterior shots.

[Andy Bettencourt]

Best looking Sentra I ever saw.

[dominojd]

That's a show car not a race car. :)

[Racerlinn]

That's a show car not a race car. :)

It's a race car, not a demolition derby car. :D

[Brettt]

Okay! Well it's been a while since I've posted in my own thread, but that's because we've been busy building a race car. After a long and mostly fun-ish process, the cage, dash, seat, most everything, is done. We have run into a bit of a hurdle though. I know that you have to remove the wheel lock, but as far as we can tell, the wheel lock is inside the ignition assembly. I would've thought that you could unbolt this assembly somehow, but it seems to be fastened with magical fasteners that leave a guy no way of removal.

And so I ask you, you incredibly helpful IT racers that you are: how the heck do I remove the wheel lock on a B13 Sentra? Greg/others with experience with this car, how did you get it done? All suggestions will be rewarded with a sincere and hearty "Thank you!"

I know I said I would get up some pics before, but this time I mean it. As soon as the cage is painted and the seat and belts are in, pictures will be seen by all who wish to see a pretty good looking race car. The suspension isn't on yet, but it has arrived. I have tomorrow off and I plan on doing it then. I ended up going with the Ksport Version RR coilovers. I know a lot of people said they implode after a year, but no one saying that had the RR system to my knowledge. They most definitely won't be used on a daily basis, so I went ahead and took a bit of a chance. The included front camber plates, adjustability, and fact that I could choose what rates I wanted for no extra charge were what sold me. I'll definitely let you guys know if they explode on day 1. :blink:

-Travis- I'll shoot you an email here in a little bit. I was hoping to swing by this Saturday to pick up these tires. I know Easter is on Sunday, but I only live 3 hours away so it would be a day trip for us.

Thanks guys!

[Greg Amy]

...how the heck do I remove the wheel lock on a B13 Sentra? Greg/others with experience with this car, how did you get it done?

Removed the whole assembly, installed dash switches. - GA

[Mike Mackaman]

Two ways I have seen this done, and keep the ignition switch:
1. Remove the switch, cut a section of beer or soda can and wrap it around the column, resinstall the switch. Keeps the lock from going into the hole.
2. Remove the switch, retract the lock, drill 1/8" hole through the whole thing. Drive a 1/8" roll pin through the whole deal. Now it won't move.

I have seen the first used on many cars I have worked on, I have the second on my car.

I was following a lady in the first race of my first school at Lowes Motor Speedway in the early '90's and she lost it going into #1 and hit the tires. She ended up on her side with the roof facing traffic. Fuel pump was still running, but the driver had temporarily shut down. The battery sparked and ignited the fuel and started a fire. The Corner workers couldn't find the shut off, as the ignition had been removed. I finally reached in and shut it off since I had a full suit, gloves, and helmet still on. But remember, this is all prior to mandatory cutoff switches. Caused me to install one several years before they became mandatory, cells too!

Mike

[Greg Amy]

The Corner workers couldn't find the shut off, as the ignition had been removed....But remember, this is all prior to mandatory cutoff switches.
Obviously, since they are now mandated along with decals to find them, that's a moot point. Though I do wish we'd standardize on location and style...

[Racerlinn]

http://www.sr20forum.com/autocross-rally-racing/85769-steering-wheel-lock-removal.html

Been there, done that.

[Brettt]

Well we got to the track and I passed the driver's school! Promptly followed by a catastrophic engine failure and a ball of flame. I'm really hoping that someone somewhere got some pics of the fireball, but my sister took a few pics of the car before and after the boom that I'll put up here as soon as she emails them to me. I just got home and don't have enough time to tell the story right now, but I'll get on that tomorrow probably.

-I just wanted to say that you guys were a great help and really were a big part of us getting the car safe and to the track. You rock!

Greg- I'm planning on sending you an email tomorrow because I am suddenly VERY interested in building a reliable motor (now that we have to put one together :shrug:) and was hoping that you might have some insights there.

Cheers to you guys!

[Greg Amy]

Ugh. Yeah, it happens, but it's most definitely preventable, starting with using ARP rod bolts and ensuring rod bearing clearances are good.

Start looking for a good core that doesn't have a spun rod bearing; those can actually be hard to find. Most of the ones you run across are pull-outs for JDM installs, but the reason they're doing that is because they spun a rod bearing...

Send me a note, we'll hook you up. - GA

[Brettt]

I know I keep saying I'll post some pics, so here you go. My sister put them in an album with a couple others. Mine is the black SE-R. Some of the "engine hole pics" didn't turn out too well, but you get the idea.

http://share.shutterfly.com/share/received/welcome.sfly?fid=ecd429a567fe18ef&sid=0AZsmLdo2csmTmw

Enjoy!