MegaSquirt PNP for Miatas

[tnord]

http://www.diyautotune.com/catalog/megasquirtpnp-c-40.html?osCsid=4c9f6d9ce652df3e3c3280033cd2a1cd

http://www.diyautotune.com/images/products/mspnp-mm9093/mspnp_black_backgr.gif

is there anyone out there using these things for their miata?

1) how easy is the interface to use?
2) how close is the tune that's pre-loaded? how many hours on the dyno to optimize?
3) does this solution give up anything to something fancier like a Haltech or whatever...
4) does it work better on any miata iteration than the other? (90-93 vs 94-95 vs 96-97)
5) is there anything like this available for the 99-00?

[Wreckerboy]

Travis - In addition to the many MS forums that are out there, this stuff gets big play over at the Grassroots Motorsports forum as well ( www.grassrootsmotorsports.com (http://www.grassrootsmotorsports.com) )

[tnord]

MS forums eh? i'll have to go look for those i guess. thanks.

[Wreckerboy]

http://www.miataturbo.net/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=18

http://www.msefi.com/index.php

On the GRM forums look for a user named MaddScientist Matt, who works for MS.

[C. Ludwig]

If any of you guys are looking for plug and play units we can provide a Haltech system for any of the Miatas or RX-7s. Most of the Hondas, Toyotas, and Nissans too for that matter. The price point is higher than that of the MS but you gain a lot of resolution, flexibility, and datalogging power over the MS units. Our E8 and E11 units are also CAN capable for anyone that may have or want to add a dash/logger unit with CAN input. Meaning with one connection the dash will display all the info the ECU is seeing/using.

To answer the earlier question on how long it should take to tune a system, if you are starting with a clean slate tune and need to work through fuel and ignition and have absolutely no idea where to start on either an experienced tuner should be able to work through the calibration in 3-6 hours. Some of that will depend on how the cooling system responds and how capable the fans of the dyno are at keeping the engine cool. Some shops and cars just don't cool well and you spend more time letting the engine cool than tuning. If you have a good base map and a good idea of where you need the timing you should be able to work through everything in around 2-3 hours. A very strongly supported adage in the world of standalone systems is to go with the system your tuner knows. While all systems really do the same thing when it comes down to it and IMO if you can work with one system you should be able to work with any of them, there are idiosyncrasies of each system that makes it prudent to have experience with that system before jumping in. And you don't want to spend time on a dyno learning the software interface. BTW, I'm available to travel for tuning and installation. ;)

[tnord]

thanks rob. i was hoping to get more IT specific information since i bet 98% of people with a MS are running some sort of boost. i'll browse through those sites and see if i can at least figure out how the thing works, and if it's something i want to tackle.

Chris -
I'm sure your units are great, and the single point connection for the data aq display is uber-cool. I'm not a guy with deep pockets though, and i'm guessing these systems are in the multiple thousands of dollar range. Thanks for your estimates on tuning time as well, the 2-3hr figure is kinda what i had in my head.

[Flyin' MacLean]

I was ready to put one of those in my car before I sold it. Mac Spikes has one for his 1.8 I believe.

Contact DIYAutoTune and they'll give you the details on the non-boosted cars they've installed these in. DIY are very close to my house and I know at least 10 cars that have these units installed, all LOVE them, all made big non-boosted power by installing them.

IMHO installing one of these is as close to a no-brainer as you can get ESPECIALLY if you have a 1.8 with a legal OEM chip and are running with the crappy air-fuel mixture you get stock.

I know they were working on a '99 version, don't know the status.

[JWX]

1) how easy is the interface to use?
2) how close is the tune that's pre-loaded? how many hours on the dyno to optimize?
3) does this solution give up anything to something fancier like a Haltech or whatever...
4) does it work better on any miata iteration than the other? (90-93 vs 94-95 vs 96-97)
5) is there anything like this available for the 99-00?


How easy the interface is would depend upon what you are use to. Ive heard a lot of gusy praise MegaTune, others hate it. You can download the tuning software and stuff though.

The map that is comes with it pretty conservative and thats for a good reason. I wouldn't think it would take very long to get it dialed in.

It really depends what you are looking for exactly. We have engine datalogging, and a number of other features. I'm not really sure what Hal-tech offers though, or how they compare.

There isn't really one that it stands out for, but that might not been what you are asking.

Nothing out for the 99-00 yet.


the MT forums would be a good place to get reviews, as there are a good mix of MSPNP users, and the hardcore DIY guys. You should be able to get some good information there.

[tnord]

thanks Colin.

i know Mac has one, but I know Mac pretty well, and i HIGHLY doubt that good-ol-boy has any clue how it works. :D

i've heard some power figures on 1.8 cars also and was floored. you're right....it's a no brainer. what i don't know is how big of gains the 1.6 cars see over just messing with the AFM. thanks for the data points on the people that have them installed and are happy. i'll probably contact DIY once i get a car, for right now i'm just trying to determine which is the best miata iteration to go with.

[FoundSoul]

Travis-- Jerry from DIYAutoTune here.. Definitely make your own decision here, and there is something to be said for using a system your tuner knows, though the MS interface is extremely easy to use. Mac Spikes is actually running an MSPNP on his IT car, you could chat him up.

You're right alot of the guys running these are running boost, but that's simply as that's the forums we hung out on a bunch and borrowed beta testers from during development. That and we have a 250+ whp boost 91 Miata running an MSPNP. We also have a fairly mild N/A 95 Miata running an MSPNP. Both run great and the 95 picked up power with a good tune too. The 96/97 test cars we borrowed for that models dev process responded well too of course. Bottom line, it's a great product and the price is tough to beat. The base map is a great starting point, very driveable unless you're modded to the gills, and makes tuning a breeze. I have to agree with the above, tuning time varies with any EMS, and one of the biggest factors is how cool does it stay while on the dyno. In some cases (many in fact) you'll spend more time waiting for the car to cool down than you do tuning, that costs you money. I'm guessing your car has a fairly adequate cooling system though, and in general Miata's aren't that bad off in my experience. For the racer crowd that I know is running adequate fuel, I can even give you some pointers to end up with a very solid ignition map quick, only needing minor touch on the dyno. We have a Dynapack in house, and basically tuned the ignition map optimally, and then pulled 3 degrees across all load ranges from 2300rpms on up to redline. This was on pump93 fuel. If you're running pump93 or better you should be able to drop this back in and be 90% there, just letting your tuner fine tune from there based on the fuel you're running and your engines unique needs. They will of course need to go through your entire fuel table, but that takes no time at all.

Any questions... just let us know.

[Greg Amy]

I can't speak for the Megatune/Squirt specifically. However, our team spent several hours with Jerry on DIY's Dynapack before last year's ARRC, tuning the NX2000. Jerry right jumped in there and helped us fine-tune the Calumsult-based NX; he and Kevin Hart picked up on that software almost like they knew it already, and Jerry's very sharp on what it takes to make an engine run right.

Jerry knows of what he speaks, and all the employees of DIY were extremely pleasant and helpful. I was impressed with their operation and wouldn't hesitate for a moment to spend money with them.

Greg Amy

[tnord]

Jerry -

Thanks so much for popping in on this discussion.

first off, "my tuner" is probably going to be me, and i've never messed with this stuff before, so i'm starting with a blank slate and an open mind as to what's the best option. yes, i do know which dyno i'll be taking it to, but his dyno business is not his full-time job, so i'm not really expecting him to setup this system for me.

i have lots of questions, but i'll save most of them for a phone conversation after i get a car. a couple i do have are if there will be a PNP system for the 99-00 miata in the near future, and if the ECU has the ability to store multiple tunes for say......multiple fuel types?

thanks.

[FoundSoul]

We don't have a 99-00 model in the works just yet. We plan to make it happen but decided to focus on some other cars for a bit and come back around to Miatas. We've got two models in the works now, and the 99-00 Miata is slated to be next more than likely.

On your second question, you can store as many maps as you'd like on your PC in the form of .msq files that can be loaded in about 10 seconds. Takes longer to plug your laptop in, and that only takes a few seconds itself. Whole process can be done in a minute or two.

[tnord]

what kind of timeframe are you thinking for the 99-00? like 6mos? 1yr? 3yrs?

[shwah]

Jerry - I just sent you a PM with some questions, but sometimes people forget to enable PM with their account here, so just letting you know to check.

cheers,

[FoundSoul]

what kind of timeframe are you thinking for the 99-00? like 6mos? 1yr? 3yrs?

Hard to say with a solid degree of accuracy. A year seems fair, I'd like it to be sooner, but I wouldn't advise you to hold out exactly 12 months expecting it to be ready to ship. We haven't started yet and have two MSPNP projects in front of it, and a few other projects in the works too. I'm working on cranking up the R&D work here though to make things come together faster than they have as of late... I'm stretched too thin to do it all. Matt to the rescue ;).

[Dave Burchfield]

For what it's worth.........I would call Chris and have him take care of business. The reason I say this is because, after a number of years chasing various gremlins, losing race weekends, and wasting money, I took my car to him and had the Haltech installed and had him tune it. The cost was to go to two less race weekends in a season. Last weekend was the first time out with it, and I learned that the car is now well better than the driver. In the 8 years I have owned it, the car has not run better.

Racing is now fun again.

[avu3]

Travis,

We have one. It only took a little bit to get it to work. for IT, out of the box, the tune is pretty far off. I've got about 3 hours on a dyno doing spart tables.

Install was painless.

I've never gotten it "RIGHT". I had what I thought was a good tune on the dyno, but on track the car was a total dog. The stock ECU and some afm adjutments was a lot better to the butt dyno than the work on the Chassis. I think my error is in spark but...

Blew the motor up so we haven't gotten back to finishing making it work.

STRONGLY recommend going with a wideband hookup, and I wish I'd thought twice about having datalogging for it.

Jerry's guys have been fairly helpful via email. I think they'd be more helpful if I was smarter and asked more articulate questions (not a dig on them, I just think I'm too stupid to educate).

I think it would be worth paying someone who knows how to tune it to teach you the basics at the dyno with your car, etc.

S

[Eagle7]

...In the 8 years I have owned it, the car has not run better.

Racing is now fun again.

:happy204::happy204::happy204::happy204:

[FoundSoul]

I think it would be worth paying someone who knows how to tune it to teach you the basics at the dyno with your car, etc.



Those last words say it all. For the hardcore DIY crew I encourage exploring and using the MS to learn to tune too. For the race crew though... you need it right, right now. You need it dialed in to perfection on a LOAD BEARING, STEADY STATE dyno. Not a DynoJet or any other inertia dyno that's going to put unrealistic levels of load on the car causing you to tune wacky WOT advance levels, and not allow you to tune the partial throttle areas of the table at all. I'm not sure what kind of dyno avu3's car was tuned on, but I'm going to guess it was inertia only and ended up with way too much advance and very likely too little fuel, the combination of which will cause both a loss of power and detonation. A pro tuner can fudge his way through tuning WOT advance on a inertia dyno reasonably well though some guesswork is still involved, it's nothing compared to a proper steady state dyno with a good tuner. Not to mention they can tune your WHOLE table.

From a engine control standpoint, the MSPNP gives you all the capability you'll ever need. It just needs to be tuned for your engine. The base map was tuned for a stock motor, you'll have to retweak based on your setup. But the base map shouldn't be that far out. I'd be glad to help one of you guys set one up right for your car. It's easy to do and we've got the equipment. Mac-- when are you in town next?

[tnord]

thanks again jerry, that's more great information regarding how the tuning needs to be done on specific types of dynos. i'll have to talk to my guy and see if he has that capability.

[C. Ludwig]

Those last words say it all. For the hardcore DIY crew I encourage exploring and using the MS to learn to tune too. For the race crew though... you need it right, right now. You need it dialed in to perfection on a LOAD BEARING, STEADY STATE dyno. Not a DynoJet or any other inertia dyno that's going to put unrealistic levels of load on the car causing you to tune wacky WOT advance levels, and not allow you to tune the partial throttle areas of the table at all. I'm not sure what kind of dyno avu3's car was tuned on, but I'm going to guess it was inertia only and ended up with way too much advance and very likely too little fuel, the combination of which will cause both a loss of power and detonation. A pro tuner can fudge his way through tuning WOT advance on a inertia dyno reasonably well though some guesswork is still involved, it's nothing compared to a proper steady state dyno with a good tuner. Not to mention they can tune your WHOLE table.

+1 Good advice.

[avu3]

I somewhat misspoke in my post, we spent most of our time tuning Fuel, and never really futzed with Spark.

I think the tune was off because our car is a pretty fully built ITA car. Intake track, Header, Exhaust, motor, all not stock. It started and ran, it just was lean out of the box.

Our car WAS tuned on a steady state dyno, I accept most of the blame for it not being right on track. I think another contributing factor was that the motor was already going sour, I just didn't realize it.

Thanks much for the feedback, Jerry.

Scott

[Eagle7]

...The stock ECU and some afm adjutments ...
I don't understand what adjustments you would make to the AFM.

[C. Ludwig]

I don't understand what adjustments you would make to the AFM.

It's common to tweak the ouput of the flapper door AFMs to fool the ECU into changing the mixture.

[Eagle7]

On an IT or SM car? Doesn't sound legal.

[Edit] Oh, I was thinking mechanical change. I guess resistors would be legal.

[JIgou]

The thing about the AFM adjustment is that it ventures into the whole "Can you prove it - what are the factory specs" thing that permeates the Spec Miata world.

Jerry, do you have any thoughts about the gains a well-tuned 1.6 Miata with a pretty much stock setup might see with a Megasquirt setup? I'm sure I'm not the only 1.6 SM driver toying with the move to IT.... (Yeah, I know it's hard to quantify...)

Jarrod

[FoundSoul]

I may be able to shed some light there... I actually tuned the base map for the 1.6 cars on Scott Siegel's SM car here locally, on what has since become my dyno but this was back a year and a half ago when it was at the local Subaru dealership Scott used to tune at, I later bought the dyno from them when Scott left. Long story there ;).

We tested his car on his stock ECU as he had been running it in SM with a fairly standard SM setup. He was running the standard issue Racing Beat intake, with the AFM, and had his timing advanced to 14* base on the stock ECU. Here are the results of the stock ECU versus the MSPNP MM9093 dialed in with the AFM still in place:

http://megasquirtpnp.com/images/mm9093/dyno/siegel/spec_miata_siegel_stockecu_vs_mm9093_withoutafm_me d.gif
That's about 9 ft/lbs down low, and still 5.5 ft/lbs up top and 6.6whp up top, with gains across the board.

Then even though it wouldn't be legal to completely remove the AFM in SM or IT I don't believe, we tested it anyways and saw further gains:
http://megasquirtpnp.com/images/mm9093/dyno/siegel/spec_miata_siegel_mm9093_withafm_vs_withoutafm_med .gif

We didn't spend alot of time on the tune when we removed the AFM so I believe we could have further improved things, gotten rid of that one dip and possibly brought out the top end a bit more, but there you have it, gains pretty much across the board.


Larger images here if you'd like:

http://megasquirtpnp.com/images/mm9093/dyno/siegel/spec_miata_siegel_stockecu_vs_mm9093_withoutafm.gi f

http://megasquirtpnp.com/images/mm9093/dyno/siegel/spec_miata_siegel_mm9093_withafm_vs_withoutafm.gif

[IPRESS]

I am going to try to get to Jerry's next month and get the "supa fly tune". We should have some info to post. on the 1.8 MSPNP, in ITA trim. I may see if we can do some tuning without the AFM too (which would work with NASA).

[tnord]

Jerry -

If I'm trying to research and learn how the software works on the 96-97 PNP unit on the msefi.com website, what should i be looking for?

is the MS-I or MS-II processor used? it seems like from the product description on your site that it's the MS-I, but from msefi.com it looks as though only the MS-II has ignition timing capabilities which certainly your product has.

is the version of Megatune i should be researching the MS1-Extra-Hi-Res HR10e?

i don't see any installation articles for the PNP on your site, is that because you truely do just plug the existing wiring harness from the OEM ECU into the MS?

[Marcus Miller]

Jerry -

If I'm trying to research and learn how the software works on the 96-97 PNP unit on the msefi.com website, what should i be looking for?

is the MS-I or MS-II processor used? it seems like from the product description on your site that it's the MS-I, but from msefi.com it looks as though only the MS-II has ignition timing capabilities which certainly your product has.

is the version of Megatune i should be researching the MS1-Extra-Hi-Res HR10e?

i don't see any installation articles for the PNP on your site, is that because you truely do just plug the existing wiring harness from the OEM ECU into the MS?

Speaking for the 90-93 unit, yes all you do is plug in the stock wiring harness and the vaccum line to the maf.

Would be interested to know more about your other questions though Travis.

Marcus

[Monkeywrench]

Can anyone comment on the rate of fuel burned with a PNP or other ECU set-ups? I would imagine it has a lower bsfc rating. Might make for a better enduro set-up.

[FoundSoul]

Sorry I missed your post from earlier this month Travis. I'll have to check my account here and see if it's setup for email notifications... but to answer your questions:

All three of the current MSPNP models for Miatas (90-93, 94-95, and 96-97) are running the MS-1 processor. The MM9093 and MM9495 models run the standard MS1 Extra firmware, and the MM9697 runs the HiRes MS1 Extra firmware. For those familiar with MegaSquirt these details are of course available. For those that just want it to work though, when you install the MegaSquirtPNP software package from the included CD-ROM or from the download link here (http://www.megasquirtpnp.com/mspnp_downloads.htm) the software is properly setup for your specific MSPNP model and you don't have to worry about what firmware version you are running unless you just want to know, or go out on your own and update it. (for example some of the MM9093 and MM9495 guys have ventured out and installed the HiRes firmware on these models, works fine of course)

The install is incredibly simple. Maybe an hour if you goof around. Check out the 'Quick Start Guides' for the install process in a nutshell on this page: http://www.megasquirtpnp.com/mspnp_installation.htm

That also has the full manuals linked ^^


Joe Tenney (ITA Miata #16) came by the shop today actually. We installed a unit in his car and I tuned it out for him. I pulled 3 comparo graphs before we did anything with his stock ECU in place with tweaked AFM, and have before and after comparison charts. I think Joe's pretty pleased. I'll post charts soon but figured I'd give him a chance to share if he wanted to.

[FoundSoul]

Can anyone comment on the rate of fuel burned with a PNP or other ECU set-ups? I would imagine it has a lower bsfc rating. Might make for a better enduro set-up.

With a standalone such as the MSPNP you have the capability to adjust your ignition timing and AFR at different load/rpm cells allowing fuel consumption to be fined tuned for sure. In any situation you can only go so lean to accomplish better fuel mileage, and in a race situation it's often even more important to err to the side of caution here for reliability's sake on a engine you're running harder than normal. But the fact remains with complete control of your ignition and fuel tables you have complete control. Is there a significant portion of the course where you're at 40% load(*) and 6000rpm? Don't see any reason why you can't lean it out there to get better mileage? You've got the power. And better yet, doing so won't effect the WOT areas of the tables at all. You don't have to compromise economy and power, generally these are sought in different load ranges, hence you can accomplish both.


(*) Load isn't really measured in percentages but in kPa, but it's easier to express this way here...

[wepsbee]

I have a 95 Ford Escort GT with a 91 engine. This is a Mazada BP 1.8 engine which was also in the Miata's. I am having trouble locating a stand alone ECU for this car. Does the Miata MS ECU also work for my car?

[FoundSoul]

I have a 95 Ford Escort GT with a 91 engine. This is a Mazada BP 1.8 engine which was also in the Miata's. I am having trouble locating a stand alone ECU for this car. Does the Miata MS ECU also work for my car?

At this point no-- you're right the motors are the same, but the ignition systems are different which is the EMS's key interface to the motor. We're actually looking at making a minor update down the road a bit to make it support this model as well though. It's on the to-do list and won't be hard to accomplish. We had a working prototype of this running in the GRM $2008 Challenge this year. Different car, but same ignition system and motor you're running.

[FoundSoul]

Alright, Joe must be busy, but he had given me the go-ahead to share everything anyways, I just wanted to give him a head start ;).


http://www.diyautotune.com/images/cars/joe_tenney_ita16/dyno chart- before - stock ecu_800.gif
Here's the best of three pulls on the stock ECU as the car arrived. Tweaked MAF, advanced distributor. WAY LEAN as observed during the pulls.


http://www.diyautotune.com/images/cars/joe_tenney_ita16/dyno chart- mspnp mm9093 tuned_800.gif
Here's the final pull after we installed the MSPNP MM9093 and tuned it out. I let the dyno auto-scale to show you the exact peaks, I'll post a direct comparison of before/after next with manual/matched scaling to make everything prettier. Right off the bat here though you can see peak numbers improved. 2.7wtq, and 5.3whp. And because it was so dramatic, you'll probably also notice the torque line stayed left and above the HP line after, where it hugged it before and even dipped under. There is a dramatic changed there, but it's hard to really read as part of that has to do with scaling, so let's scale it evenly and take another look:


http://www.diyautotune.com/images/cars/joe_tenney_ita16/dyno chart- comparison stock ecu vs mspnp mm9093_800.gif
Here's the direct comparison. Down low that's a 16ft/lb increase (nearly 20% there), that slowly tapers off as he heads toward 4800rpm. Up top there's a 4-10whp increase all the way to redline. You can see where I laid the line on the graph at 6800-6900 there's a 10.2whp/7.8wtq increase. Still making more power there than the stock ECU was at it's peak at 6300rpm.

[rockytenney]

Remove stock ecu and bracket, plug in your new DIYAutoTune Megasquirt PNP MM9093 , bolt it down, run Map line to intake, pull ST SGN 10 amp fuse, start car, goose it a couple of times, hit the kill switch, eat sandwich while looking at the car, congratulate yourself on how clever you are generally, and specifically in this case, how you exceeded your own cleverness expectations. All this for the price of a set of go to the race tires. Of course, an interface in the form of a laptop (cable included) and a dyno (not included) would be required to further optimize for your engine.
The dyno sheets as posted by Jerry indicate that the device as configured by DIYAutoTune does improve torque and hp across the range significantly. The air/fuel ratio is controlled by the unit and the AFM could be tossed for more gain. Someone may notice this missing in SCCA impound.
Jerry and the folks at DIYAutoTune have an impressive product line and development facility, and are definitely focused on customer service.

Joe Tenney
90 Miata ITA.

[tnord]

Joe -

I have little doubt that getting the car to run on the MS PNP is easy as can be. Do you do any of the tuning yourself? The dyno I will take the car to is not familiar with Megatune, and I want to be able to tune the car myself at the track, so it's something I really need to learn.

i think those are pretty good gains considering you had an already tuned AFM. was that an AFM you had tuned at the dyno before? was it an ART? i won't be running a 1.6, but i know someone who is and is considering a MS PNP. i'll be in a 96. :)

[rockytenney]

Travis,
I was the watcher and not the doer. I am confident that if I had read the manual I could have muddled through. Populating tables is a repetitive function that is easily handled and you would be working from an existing baseline specific to your 1800 as opposed to a cold start. The displays are great and the menus are more intuitive than your basic cell phone. I am sure the folks there will be able to deal with the various install and tuning problems the user gets himself into. The manual and install procs are on the web site. You will need a wideband sensor to tinker at the track.
Mac Spikes has an 1800 and is going to see Jerry on his way to the ARRC. He would probably let you know how he made out with his "supa fly tune".
The AFM was tuned by John Williams with that engine on a dyno. I am pretty certain that he got all he could get using an AFM.

Joe Tenney

[IPRESS]

I ain't tellin him nothin!:happy204:
I am pissed Joe was whooping my butt at the June race without a Megasquirt! Now I won't even be on the same lap.
Jerry if you see this I need the Curtis Mayfield approved SUPER SUPA FLY tune!

Joe , Don't worry about Travis he is just gathering ALL the info before he breaks open the tin cans in the backyard. They are Silver Certificates given to him on his 1st birthday. Oh and he also has the first nickel he ever saw. To say he will be spending wisely on this project might be a fact. Now me I buy two of everything cause I either break it or forget where I put it.:blink:

On a serious note how do I get to Jerry's place, from either downtown or RAtlanta?

[rockytenney]

I am with you Mac. I have discovered that Travis spelled backward is Sivart which according to Wiki is "he with no conscience who makes rational comparative decisions before leaping to silly endeavor". On another note, this type of individual will surely stagnate the economy while you and I will have have two of everything.
As far as that race, I remember that you insisted on taking Road Atlanta turns 6 and 7, the bypass at turn 5 to the back straight is the most excellent route.

The directions to DIY going north from downtown on I85 (in Georgia, an out parcel of Texas) to
Exit 109, left west on Old Peachtree Road.
Right on Satellite Blvd 1/2 mile maybe.
Left on Mcginnis Ferry Road (do not be taken in by the Burnette sign to the right).
Left on Burnette Road (small road just before Buford Highway up ahead).
Left on Burnette Park Drive.
Right into 3690 bldg. Suwanee, Ga. 30024.
The track is exit 129, I would use these going south also.

Have a good trip and do not destroy any relationship we think we have with Jerry.

[JIgou]

I am going to try to get to Jerry's next month and get the "supa fly tune". We should have some info to post. on the 1.8 MSPNP, in ITA trim. I may see if we can do some tuning without the AFM too (which would work with NASA).

A not-so-little birdie mentioned to me that "mission accomplished" might be appropriate?