ITS s14? is it worth it?

[Jeremy Sharer]

I have a s14 chassis that was basically given to me from a friend.. and its already patrially stripped and i was going to slowly build it into a car to road race.. after finding that they can actually be ran in ITS ( i thought only s13's could be) i was wondering if it is worth building it for an ITS car. I dont want to have spent the time building it just to realize its not competitive at all. So do yall think its worth it??

[erlrich]

Just my opinion - I believe the either the S13 or S14 could be a good car in ITS, but I don't think it will ever be a top car. It is classed at the same weight (well, +20 lbs) as the ITA car, and only makes 15 more HP stock, and I just don't see that making enough of a difference. The ITA verision is still one of the better cars in its class, although I think it has been gradually loosing ground to the H-cars over the past few years.

[Jeremy Sharer]

yea im just scared to invest the money in it.. i just want to have something so if i get better at driving i can become competitive in IT with out having to switch chassis.

[gpbmw]

The engine alone will keep you broke. Look for a really good engine builder. You would do better with an E30.

[Jeremy Sharer]

the motor probably wouldnt keep me broke cause i have built 4 KA's so far and have 2 extra motors torn apart laying at my house. i always an E30 would be more money then a 240sx would be. i love E30's they just seem expensive to build, im sure parts are much cheaper for KA's then M20's

p.s. i just realized i put s14.. and i hope u dont think im talking about M3. cause yea build and BMW S14 motor would be stupid expensive.

[CRallo]

p.s. i just realized i put s14.. and i hope u dont think im talking about M3. cause yea build and BMW S14 motor would be stupid expensive.


well this is in the nissan section...

[erlrich]

well this is in the nissan section...
I don't think gpbmw noticed...

[Jeremy Sharer]

^yea thats what i was thinking cause yea a KA is super cheap to build compared to an M20.

[CRallo]

unless he was refering to people not being able to keep them together or running right...

[DavidM]

The best developed S14 that I know of was Chris Newberry's car here in the SE that I think now resides in the central FL area - he sold it. He could finish 3rd or 4th, but didn't seem to have anything for the BMWs. He was also a heck of a driver so he got the most out of the car. His car was one of the best looking cars I've seen inside and out. He posts here occasionally as SlickS14 so you could look him up in the user directory and send him an e-mail. He would have the best opinion out of anybody on what he thought the car could achieve.

David

[JeffYoung]

Jeremy, good to meet you at Daytona this weekend.

I feel pretty strongly that an S14 can win even in a strong ITS field. As David points out, Chris Newberry built a killer one that ran up front in ITS for several years here in teh SEDiv. It had trouble with the unrestricted E36s but we all did.

Two anecdotal stories:

1. THE best ITS race I have ever seen was Chris (S14), Kent Thompson (2nd Gen RX7) and Steve Stubbs (pre SIR E36) at CMP. THey were nose to tail the entire race. Kent and Steve spun in turn 1 after the checkers....Chris was 3rd, but set fastest lap. VERY impressive.

2. Chris won his last race in that car at Charlotte -- a power track -- against a very good ITS field.

If you really like the car, it can be a winner but obviously not as easy to develop as an RX7 or an E36 or a 240/260/280z.

[bosco]

Chris Newberry's car S14 is indeed residing in central florida, now owned by Randy Effron.
Randy has not been able to race lately due to some health issues.

Squeak Kennedy filled in for Randy at Sebring Enduro shortly after Randy purchased the car and he and Mike Covello teamed up for a third behind Irish Mike and Steve Goldin. Squeak cut the race's second fastest lap at 2:36.4. As far as I know that is the quickest lap by a nissan ITS car there. Possibly, Greg Ira in the 240 Z could have been faster at some time.

I practiced with the car at Sebring short once and had a best of 1:19.0 with Chris's old tires. The car was very well sorted, the best handling IT I have ever driven, had the best brakes of any IT car I have yet raced and was as fast off the corner and down the straight as the best well driven customer speedsource cars. Not as fast as the Garcia BMW for sure and a little off of Buzz's House Speedsource car but not that much.

I believe a well driven, well built and developed S14 can still be very competitiive but not dominant.

I have owned an S13 with Mike Covello and Squeak Kennedy for a number of years, although we haven't raced it since 2006. The car had a good number of podiums in CFR, with a best of 2nd at Sebring with Squeak driving.

best lap times:
Sebring short 1:19.9
Sebring long: 2:37
Daytona: 2:19 and change

not race winning times today either but still solid.

Bosco

[CCARVER]

I have a S-13 ITS car that has been a joy to drive.
I will make it out to a heavy fielded event to see where the car stacks up.
Coming to a track near you!

[quadzjr]

Speaking solely from teh CFR region. I believe Mike F. was saying that he has ran 2:14 @ daytona in his BMW.

I am looking on purchasing an ITA 240sx.. or finding with a decent car to start with.. so far all our expereince has been building hondas.. and one MR2 in the works.. It just seems so much mroe expensive to build any front running RWD car compared to a FWD car.

[erlrich]

Speaking solely from teh CFR region. I believe Mike F. was saying that he has ran 2:14 @ daytona in his BMW.

I am looking on purchasing an ITA 240sx.. or finding with a decent car to start with.. so far all our expereince has been building hondas.. and one MR2 in the works.. It just seems so much mroe expensive to build any front running RWD car compared to a FWD car.
Here you are: http://www.improvedtouring.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24144 you aren't going to find a better deal on an ITA 240SX in decent condition. I have more than that just under the hood of my car.

[lateapex911]

For some odd reason, the ITA 240s have a pretty stout rap as being less than Honda-Mazda reliable in the engine dept. And the ITA suspension is a tricky build. They are fast...front of the pack fast, and RWD, but the story is that they just don't stay together long. I'm not sure why though.

But.....is the ITS car the same? I know it can be quick....very quick. But how's the motors reliability?

[CRallo]

But.....is the ITS car the same? I know it can be quick....very quick. But how's the motors reliability?



seems to depend on who builds it... There is a shop that seems to have given up building Nissan engines and swaps in Chevys now:blink:

From my understanding the oiling system is not great and the motor is very sensitive to oil deprivation...

[erlrich]

For some odd reason, the ITA 240s have a pretty stout rap as being less than Honda-Mazda reliable in the engine dept. And the ITA suspension is a tricky build. They are fast...front of the pack fast, and RWD, but the story is that they just don't stay together long. I'm not sure why though.
I've heard that about the sohc motors too, but I'm not sure where it comes from. I know Bob Stretch went through a motor or two, but as I understand it Bob used to like to experiment a lot. Personally (he says while looking for a wooden object to knock on), after more than a dozen race weekends, and at least as many track days and time trials, the only problem I've ever had with the motor was when I missed a 3-4 shift and got 2nd instead and zinged the motor to something north of 8k rpms. Ok for a Honda, not so good for a Nissan. Aside from that mine has been dead-nuts reliable, while I've seen more than a few CRX/Civic/Integra drivers replacing head gaskets on Saturday nights.

[DavidM]

I've been through 3 1/2 seasons on the same motor with nothing more than normal maintenance. I think it's starting to get a little tired, but it runs fine. I've had auxiliary issues like injector wires fraying causing missing and the intake manifold working loose causing a coolant leak, but the motor itself has been fine. I've zinged it a few times where I thought that was going to be it, but it keeps on trucking (it is a truck motor afterall).

Bob said he blew a motor once when he ran 93 octane so I've never run anything less than 100. In fact, I've been running 110 since it typically costs the same as 100. I think the motor may be sensitive to pinging so if you run too lean or too much advance you could be asking for it. Tristan's motor blew after some oil pressure weirdness, but he had an "incident" before that so maybe that played a part. I don't have a remote oil filter, but have no idea if that makes a difference. I've also only run Redline 30W racing oil and don't plan on changing since it seems to be working.

David

[JeffYoung]

Chris N. had some issues with his S14 motor, mostly related to cooling. I think he lost a head gasket at least once. But the car on the whole was very reliable (or at least looked that way as it was passing me......)

[lateapex911]

Chris N. had some issues with his S14 motor, mostly related to cooling. I think he lost a head gasket at least once. But the car on the whole was very reliable (or at least looked that way as it was passing me......)

EVERYthing looks reliable a it passes a Triumph!

(When will I learn to just let it go? It's a sickness, this Brit car bashing!)