8 Hour race at Road Atlanta scheduled

[Cobrar05]

NASA Southeast has scheduled an 8 hour endurance race at Road Atlanta on December 5, 2008.

If you want another longer enduro on the east coast, be sure to enter.

NASA :: South East Region (http://www.nasa-southeast.com/)

[RacerBowie]

Why oh why can't it be SCCA instead of NASA SE. bummer.

Hopefully Butch's long race idea pans out next year, rather than getting messed up by the track being closed.

[Xian]

Does NASA require a HANS now or was the semi-permanently delayed?

[Cobrar05]

A h and n restraint is required. It does not have to be a HANS however.

[Xian]

Any idea if it is required to be SFI approved? I've got an Isaac device that I've used for several years...

Thanks!
Christian

[tom_sprecher]

A h and n restraint is required. It does not have to be a HANS however.

I'm out. I keep forgetting NASA requires that and it stops me from racing NASA events. Too bad.

[Cobrar05]

Any idea if it is required to be SFI approved? I've got an Isaac device that I've used for several years...

Thanks!
Christian

Yes, SFI rating is required. I use a Hybrid from Safety Solutions.

[Cobrar05]

I'm out. I keep forgetting NASA requires that and it stops me from racing NASA events. Too bad.

We all seem to have our issues. SCCA won't let me race my Mustang in enduro competition outside of Road Atlanta.

I have no issue with the H&N restraint requirements. I have a halo racetech seat in my car based on NASA regulations and the H&N based on regulations. I didn't want to have to spend that money, but once it was spent I will admit to feeling much safer.

Its safety gear you should have. But thats just my opinion. When I race SCCA races I wear my H&N.

[RacerBowie]

We all seem to have our issues. SCCA won't let me race my Mustang in enduro competition outside of Road Atlanta.

I have no issue with the H&N restraint requirements. I have a halo racetech seat in my car based on NASA regulations and the H&N based on regulations. I didn't want to have to spend that money, but once it was spent I will admit to feeling much safer.

Its safety gear you should have. But thats just my opinion. When I race SCCA races I wear my H&N.

I have a H&N system. It is called Isaac, I feel it is the best and safest on the market, and NASA won't let me use it, so I don't race with them. Period.

[Xian]

We all seem to have our issues. SCCA won't let me race my Mustang in enduro competition outside of Road Atlanta.

I have no issue with the H&N restraint requirements. I have a halo racetech seat in my car based on NASA regulations and the H&N based on regulations. I didn't want to have to spend that money, but once it was spent I will admit to feeling much safer.

Its safety gear you should have. But thats just my opinion. When I race SCCA races I wear my H&N.

True... every organization has it's good and bad points.

Not to turn this into a H&N discussion, but I don't have an issue with a H&N requirement. The catch is that my H&N system is excluded b/c of the SFI verbiage. I too have a Halo seat (Recaro) and right side safety net... all in all a very safe setup but I'm not ready to spring another grand for an SFI H&N system when the one I have is, IMO, the safest thing on the market.

Hopefully NASA will open up it's H&N policy or I may be forced to change my device of choice if SCCA and all the other clubs go the same route as NASA. Regardless, it sounds like the RA event will be a blast. Best of luck and thanks for the FYI that it's on the calendar!

Christian

[Cobrar05]

My take is that the SFI requirement is going to continue thru the racing groups. Its pretty clear that NASA business model is to be more inclusive and not less so. So, my take on this particular issue is that they made their choice with the idea that it was made within the mainstream.

[gsbaker]

My take is that the SFI requirement is going to continue thru the racing groups. Its pretty clear that NASA business model is to be more inclusive and not less so. So, my take on this particular issue is that they made their choice with the idea that it was made within the mainstream.
It is not within the mainstream.

Their thinking is different since a NASA DE driver broke his neck in two places in a side impact a couple of weeks ago. Had he been a racer and not allowed to use an ISAAC, he would be suing NASA into the next dimension.

Talk about dodging a bullet. Those guys need to find a lawyer who can learn them some risk mitigation.

[Cobrar05]

ok...I am just here to mention the race. road atlanta is popular and eight hour races are rare.

i am really not into the politics of this stuff. i am not trying to sell a product. i don't support one product
over another.

btw...educate me. is the isaac approved for nascar, irl, nhra, alms, or grand am?

[pgipson]

NASA Southeast has scheduled an 8 hour endurance race at Road Atlanta on December 5, 2008

I lived in and around Atlanta for a few years. An 8 hour race on the 5th of December may be a challenge. Certainly won't need a cool shirt.

[erlrich]

btw...educate me. is the isaac approved for nascar, irl, nhra, alms, or grand am?
not sure about NHRA, but nope on the rest - SFI took care of that.

[gsbaker]

...btw...educate me. is the isaac approved for nascar, irl, nhra, alms, or grand am?
Those places where the decision was made 5+ years ago and everyone uses a $10K seat? No.

[Cobrar05]

Those places where the decision was made 5+ years ago and everyone uses a $10K seat? No.

Do Koni Challenge and Miller Cup cars have $10k seats in them? Are you saying that the more expensive seat allows NASCAR and ALMS to require an inferior H&N device?

I realize that Safety Solutions thinks the R3 and the Hybrid are better than HANS. I imagine that my friends at HANS would say the same about them. So, that ISAAC LLC would think both HANS and Safety Solutions are inferior and politically proped up is natural as well. I am just not sure why its necessary to degrade NASA over their SFI requirements when each of the pro race groups seem to require the same.

[Cobrar05]

I lived in and around Atlanta for a few years. An 8 hour race on the 5th of December may be a challenge. Certainly won't need a cool shirt.

VIR at the end of October for 13 Hours ain't no picnic either, but its a popular race.
The originally scheduled 5 hour race that Butch attempted was in February. Yes?
Don't beat down December til you've seen what February is like there.

[shwah]

Is this the part where everyone jumps on a NASA bashing band wagon like they did at the NASA forum at the mention of ITFest, or do we not do that here?

Just wondering:shrug:

[Cobrar05]

Registration is open for the 8 Hour at Road Atlanta in December. Its a real bargain.
NASA :: South East Region (http://www.nasa-southeast.com/2008Dec05.jsp)

[Knestis]

We'd totally do this witih the Golf if anyone is interested in codriving. It would be three stints and if it rained...? Mmmmm, baaaaybeeee.

K

[924Guy]

We'd totally do this witih the Golf if anyone is interested in codriving. It would be three stints and if it rained...? Mmmmm, baaaaybeeee.

K

LOL... you guys with your FWD keep going on about rain... onna these days it's gonna rain at the IT-Fest, and you'll REALLY look foolish... ;)

[JeffYoung]

The conceptual problem for me with NASA is that they seemed to based on the idea of "you build the car, then we class it" v. the SCCA model of "we make the classes, then you build to them."

While the former is more inclusive, and it also gives you things like Spec Focus and Spec SE-R that are flash in the pan classes. With SCCA you get stability and, at least from my experience, much tighter competition.

I enjoyed the two NASA events I ran, but I can't say I thought I was really "competing." My run group was a Lotus 7, a 911 turbo, me, a 190E, some Miatas and a Z car. Frankengroup. Very different from a tight and tough SEDiv ITS field. Kind of like racing lite........

There's a place for both but I am thinking more and more they aren't the direct competitors they appear to be on the surface.

[IPRESS]

Guys, either you want to race with SCCA, or you want to race with NASA or you run with both. Every time there is a NASA event this board seems to wade through all of NASA's warts. If we did that with every SCCA event that comes across here (and there are many warts on those events too) this would have hits like a porn site! Hey NASA is different then ol time SCCA.
NASA is what it is. SCCA is what it is. They both draw club racers so right or wrong they are in competition. I for one think that for the long run NASA being in business makes SCCA better. In the areas I race SCCA customer service has been better then ever this year. In the NASA evnts I have run in the past the atitude has always been "Glad to have you in our event." I think this has bled over into SCCA.

[Cobrar05]

Jeff,

I see your point of view, but as a Mustang racer its the opposite. If I build a Mustang race car based on OEM technology from more than the last decade, I don't have a real SCCA option.

I mean unless I run ITO/ITE which last time had me racing against an SPO like car running 2:04's on the full course at VIR or World Challenge Corvettes and Vipers. An SCCA version of frankenclass.

At NASA I can race my Mustangs in enduros where in the SCCA I only occasionally get a class waiver to allow me to run an ECR.

I race where I am invited. I will run both ECR's at VIR in October and the Enduro at the ARRC. I will also run NASA enduros because I can.

If you don't like NASA or you don't want to race, that's ok. Its an 8 hour race at Road Atlanta. Its a new event that we have none of on the east coast that I know of. We have a couple of 12 hour races and a 24 at ledges, plus a bunch of 3 hour races. We have nothing beyond the ARRC 3 hour at Road Atlanta and nothing in the 8 hour range at all.

This is just an invitation. Just like any party invite, you don't have to use it.

[JeffYoung]

Rob, I don't disagree with you or Mark. I think the conceptual differences between SCCA (and ITO/ITE is a catchall class that, honestly, is sort of an after thought in the IT world) and NASA is pretty clear. Both have their advantages and disadvantages. My point was I wonder how much competition actually exists between the two given their distinct differences.

I've got nothing against the 8 hour at Atlanta, and wish it a ton of success. Should be a great event.

As you know, I also share your concern about the lack of a place for V8 Mustangs and Camaros in existing "regular" IT classes. I think it is a huge hole we have to fill. Your car still, in my view, exceeds the performance potential of ITR, but maybe the next class -- which will have to come at some point -- above R will allow the "modern" Mustangs and Camaros a place to run. In fact, I think your car is a perfect NASA car and a "bad" SCCA car (at the moment) for precisely that reason -- you built (or bought) a car to race, not to race in a particular SCCA class.

Classic NASA/SCCA difference I think.




Jeff,

I see your point of view, but as a Mustang racer its the opposite. If I build a Mustang race car based on OEM technology from more than the last decade, I don't have a real SCCA option.

I mean unless I run ITO/ITE which last time had me racing against an SPO like car running 2:04's on the full course at VIR or World Challenge Corvettes and Vipers. An SCCA version of frankenclass.

At NASA I can race my Mustangs in enduros where in the SCCA I only occasionally get a class waiver to allow me to run an ECR.

I race where I am invited. I will run both ECR's at VIR in October and the Enduro at the ARRC. I will also run NASA enduros because I can.

If you don't like NASA or you don't want to race, that's ok. Its an 8 hour race at Road Atlanta. Its a new event that we have none of on the east coast that I know of. We have a couple of 12 hour races and a 24 at ledges, plus a bunch of 3 hour races. We have nothing beyond the ARRC 3 hour at Road Atlanta and nothing in the 8 hour range at all.

This is just an invitation. Just like any party invite, you don't have to use it.

[Cobrar05]

actually, Jeff, I bought a champion SCCA T1 car with the mistaken impression that I could race it in SCCA competition. It had aged out of T1 and had been effectively orphaned.

[Xian]

With the entry costs being as low as they are, this event would still be a good "value" as a protracted test & tune for anyone looking to sort out a chassis or just get seat time at RA.

[JeffYoung]

Got it, didn't know the history behind the car.

It's funny, that problem -- the aging out of Showroom Stock cars with no place to go -- is one of the primary reasons we have IT.

I agree your car has been orphaned. No good place for it to run right now. SCCA's classification system makes some sense once you run SCCA for a while, but for the new guy (and I had this problem) it's hard. I had no clue as to what classes were popular, etc.

Assume we came up with a new "ITQ" class for cars with say, 240 to 300/310 stock hp and all other IT rules in place. Would your car qualify? I have no idea -- just want to get a feel for what the car has had done to it.

P.S. Note breakdown of "stock" IT hp ranges (and note this is my perception, not the "rule"):

ITC: 60-90 hp
ITB: 90 to 110 hp
ITA: 100ish to 140ish hp
ITS: 140ish to 190ish hp
ITR: 190ish to 240ish

You car might even be a tough fit in the "next" IT class above Q.

[Cobrar05]

No...It was a T1 car. 5.8L engine/385hp factory rating. 300hp to the wheels, yes.

[Knestis]

Having (mostly) survived the VIR 13, we're looking at the NASA 8 hours as our next major event. Anyone interested...?

Do we know what the schedule is going to be yet (e.g., night racing)??

K

[Greg Amy]

Having (mostly) survived the VIR 13, we're looking at the NASA 8 hours as our next major event. Anyone interested...?
Hmmm..... (he says, interestingly...)

[Knestis]

Rain? Hmmm?

:026:

K

[Ron]

We are trying real hard to do the race in the mustang. It turns out we just did not have enough oil in the pan and we spun a rod bearing. The rest of the motor looks great so we should be there. Having a brand new pan we just underestimated where the oil was going. Tom was really trying to keep the oil away from the crank, we just pushed the limits.

Ron