SIC Roebling - Tech Inspection Issues w/outside tech?

[Ron Earp]

I recently heard that a tech inspector came in from Topeka over the weekend to investigate some cars at Roebling. Some issues were found with some of the SM cars (and maybe others I don't know), but no action taken as I understand it despite the tech inspector's advisory. Surely this is a small piece of what actually happened, anyone have the true story on this, or is it a bunch of bunk?

Thanks much,
Ron

[charrbq]

Ouch! That could have implications if correct!

[Parrish57]

In a conversation with one of our SEDIV tech guys he mentioned meeting an inspector from Topeka while at the SIC. He didn't say anything about rules infractions but I will ask......

[Greg Amy]

A Topeka tech guy showed up at a LRP National this year. I was a lowly tech weenie so didn't really get into why he was there, but it seemed he was simply there observing... - GA

[Toni]

There was a noncompliant car. Tech noted the issues correctly and gave report to stewards. There was a miscommunication (no communication?) from there. Incorrect option was taken on CSA by a steward. Car was released before communication and resulting CSA could be corrected. We goofed.

Toni Creighton

[EAPCPA]

Geeee! wonder how much race engineering had to pay for that miscommunication. OOps did I say that shame on me!! :dead_horse:

[lateapex911]

Geeee! wonder how much race engineering had to pay for that miscommunication. OOps did I say that shame on me!! :dead_horse:
[/b]


Who is race engineering? Is this a joke or an accusation?

[Ron Earp]

I don't know who it involves, doesn't much matter to me. Just find it interested that tech inspectors are coming in from HQ and it looks like it has been done before a LRP too. I didn't know they did that sort of thing, pretty cool.

R

[dickita15]

occasionally you will see someone who is staff show up at a distant event, usually it is reasearch or as at the NHIS national we had the National Administrator of Tech show up. he didi some teaching and also gave some feedback on tech's operations.

[Fastfred92]

Ron, we had two tech guys and the head of club racing at the VIR nationals a few years back, it happens more than you know.

[JeffYoung]

WARNING AND DISCLAIMER -- I KNOW NONE OF THIS TO BE FACTUALLY TRUE, IT IS ONLY THE "STORIES" THAT I HAVE HEARD FLOATING AROUND.

Jake, Race Engineering is Bob Thornton's outfit from down near Charlotte. Builds very fast Miatas, Miata motors and clutches.

Supposedly (and I say supposedly because I don't know, have just heard, and honestly don't really care all that much) after the test day, there were several cam swaps on the OPM (Tom Fowler's outfit, another set of very fast, very well prepared cars). Given all of the confusion on the cam rule, I can see why this MIGHT have happened.

Then, after the race on Sunday, supposedly a car or several cars went through Tech, failed, and nothing was done. Toni cleared that up for us above -- it was one car, and the "passing" of it was due to a miscommunication.

No discussion of this on the SM board which leads me to believe it was a non event. Good to see tech from National show up at our regional championship. I like that.

JEFF

[x-ring]

Given all of the confusion on the cam rule, I can see why this MIGHT have happened.[/b]

How can there possibly be confusion about SM cams? The cam specifications have been published since June. That was NOT a smarta$$ question. As you may (or may not) know I have more than a passing interest in SM compliance, at least until the middle of this month.



Then, after the race on Sunday, supposedly a car or several cars went through Tech, failed, and nothing was done. Toni cleared that up for us above -- it was one car, and the "passing" of it was due to a miscommunication.

No discussion of this on the SM board which leads me to believe it was a non event. [/b]

Toni told me that the area of non-compliance was not particularly performance enhancing, but rules are rules, and the car shouldn't have been released with only a logbook note, particularly at a championship race.



Good to see tech from National show up at our regional championship. I like that.[/b]

As someone else said, they travel quite a bit. They just don’t make a big deal out of it.

See you in Kansas next week?

[CaptainWho]

I don't know about tech people coming in from HQ, but I've worked races in SEDiv where F&C people from HQ showed up. As far as was discussed at the morning worker meeting, they were there to observe and maybe advise.

[Ron Earp]

Toni told me that the area of non-compliance was not particularly performance enhancing,

[/b]

I like that quote, seems like a good one to use when questioned on something. I'll remember it.

"Mr. Earp, looks like your head prep work is questionable".

"Oh, yeah, I know, but that isn't particularily performance enhancing."

I'm poking fun, but why do it if it "isn't particularily performance enhancing"? Was it just one car or a few cars with the same thing?

Ron

[gprodracer]

FYI,

Headquarters sends people to random events, to check random things every now and then. The last really invasive one I know of down here was to an ECR event at Sebring in the mid 90's. The top 4 in all classes of the ECR had to pull heads, manifiolds, etc. and all cams were checked resulting in at least one DQ, for an illegal cam.
I'm not sure what prompts these visits (rumor was that a lot of IT cheating was occuring in SEDIV, but who knows?) but I was glad to see that Headquarters actually cared about what was going on in Regional racing.
I'm sure there have been several more since then, so you never know...
Anyone with more info, please post.
Toni, can you release anything else? I understand if you can't.

BTW, I'm not affiliated in any way with R.E, OPM, or any SM driver, but unless anyone has any official news, it is probably in bad taste to imply that they did anything wrong.. just my opinion.

Thanks,

Mark

[Harvey]

Gee thanks Mark for that reminder.

The SARRC has had provisions for years to bring in Tech people from National for the SIC it just never seemed to come together because of conflicts with the runoffs??

[x-ring]

I like that quote, seems like a good one to use when questioned on something. I'll remember it.

"Mr. Earp, looks like your head prep work is questionable".

"Oh, yeah, I know, but that isn't particularily performance enhancing."

I'm poking fun, but why do it if it "isn't particularily performance enhancing"? Was it just one car or a few cars with the same thing?

Ron
[/b]

OK, so maybe I didn't phrase that particularly well.

Toni told me that a competitor had done something to his/her car when preparing it that while non-compliant, made no difference, in her opinion, to the on-track potential of the car.

SM is a tightly regulated class. It would be easy to make a long list of things you could do to an SM that would not make it any 'better' (that is faster, more reliable, more comfortable, whatever) that are not within the bounds of the rules.

[Toni]

The non compliant car had additional modifications to the driver’s compartment. At least some of these were safety items that should have been corrected before an annual tech approval was issued.

Invasive checks made post race found all cars to be compliant in those areas checked.

Toni

[JeffYoung]

Thanks for the clarification Toni.

Mark, probably should not have posted what I "heard" because I don't mean, at all, to imply that OPM, RE or ANYONE else was cheating. Actually, scratch, I'm glad I did, because Toni came here and clarified the situation (thanks for that). All I have seen from OPM and RE cars are well prepped and fast cars, well-driven.

Honestly, the "they must be cheating" talk (especially in SM) drives me bonkers. Way too much of it without much to back it up.

[Fastfred92]

The non compliant car had additional modifications to the driver’s compartment. At least some of these were safety items that should have been corrected before an annual tech approval was issued.

Invasive checks made post race found all cars to be compliant in those areas checked.

Toni
[/b]


Sounds like maybe the old seatbelt bulkhead thing is rearing its ugly head again???

[raceengineering]

It has been brought to my attention that some accusations and insinuations regarding myself and Race Engineering have been voiced on this forum.

Who is Race Engineering?... We are an engine builder specializing in Spec Miata engines. We build approximately 200 engines per year and also build complete race Spec Miatas as well as differentials and gear boxes.

To directly address the accusations and innuendo regarding what transpired during tech at the SIC my car was the John Deere #19 car. We finished 2nd in the race clinching the SARRC championship. In impound we were asked to remove our intake manifold and header, as well as remove all 4 spark plugs and jack the car up so that a gear ratio inspection could be done. We complied with these wishes the Tech Inspectors inspected theses components and we were found COMPLIANT in all areas. The before mentioned car that was found NONCOMPLIANT has nothing to do with Race Engineering nor uses any of our product.

As for the above mentioned question
"How much did it cost Race Engineering for this miscommunication?"
Race Engineering has NEVER bribed or paid monies to ANY Tech official in ANY series. Nor have any Race Engineering cars or customer cars ever been found to be non compliant and have NEVER had been assessed any points, lost any places or had any fines or tech issues.

Race Engineering won the East Coast Pro Miata Championship in 2005, the North American Pro Miata Overall Championship in 2005, the Carolina Pro Cup Spec Miata in 2005, the ARRC Spec Miata in 2005, 4 Spec Miata divisional championships in National competition in 2006 as well as the SARRC Spec Miata in 2006. Through all of these championships and races our cars have been torn down in tech on numerous occasions parts have been confiscated, engines have been confiscated and cars have been impounded and NEVER has there been any compliance issues... period.

I hope this clears up any confusion in regards to these questions. If anyone has any other questions please feel free to give me a call (704) 636-2452..

[gmmiata]

Ditto what Bob said! Its bad enough to hear about this kind of speculation on the SM boards, but to hear it comming from the other classes is just uncalled for.

Glenn
Crew Chief #19 SM

[Ron Earp]

Sounds like maybe the old seatbelt bulkhead thing is rearing its ugly head again???
[/b]

If it were that sort of thing it is clearly not a performance enhancing modification, that is for sure. I forgot one side on one of our cars one time and once the cage is in it isn't easily covered up. But, a quick fix to get through tech might be some aluminum tape, I've seen some cars with that.

Ron

[gprodracer]

Jeff Young,

I read your reply @ work, just got home. I see Mr Thornton @ RE has already replied to the other guys post.
That was pretty much what I was trying to say. If you mention someones business in the same post as allegations of cheating, even jokingly, the rumor mill will start going full throttle.
I'm sure you didn't intend to even imply anything, but I know how fast rumors spread through the racing community, and these race shops feed many peoples families. As you can see by Mr Thorntons response, this thread got back to him quickly, and I can understand why he'd be upset. Wasn't trying to throw you under the bus, I just knew what would happen. Like I said, I'm sure you weren't implying anything, but rumors never have a good ending.

Harvey... I believe there were 3 cars involved back then. Wasn't meant as a slam, just pointing out that headquarters does random checks that most people never hear about. How's that Volvo coming along?

Toni..thanks for clearing that up. Inquiring minds always want to know the latest, and we appreciate you keeping us up to date.

Congrats to all the newly crowned SARRC champions! I hear Roebling is now FAAAASSSSSTTTT!!!!
I can't wait to go back.

Mark

[JeffYoung]

Mark, I agree mostly. Don't mean to quibble, but in a way, I'm glad this was aired out.

The talk was happening with our without this thread, and it is good that Toni and Bob Thornton explained what happened here. I said in my first post that I thought this was a non-event, and I am glad it turned out that way.

[gprodracer]

Jeff,

:023:

It's all good!

Mark

[Harvey]

Mark:

I was only kidding I remember all too well. The Volvo is coming along painfully slow, It just does not want to put its self together.

[CaptainWho]

You need a better genie, Harvey. :D

[JeffYoung]

Amen Mark -- good racing to ya.

Jeff

[benspeed]

It has been brought to my attention that some accusations and insinuations regarding myself and Race Engineering have been voiced on this forum.

Who is Race Engineering?... We are an engine builder specializing in Spec Miata engines. We build approximately 200 engines per year and also build complete race Spec Miatas as well as differentials and gear boxes.

To directly address the accusations and innuendo regarding what transpired during tech at the SIC my car was the John Deere #19 car. We finished 2nd in the race clinching the SARRC championship. In impound we were asked to remove our intake manifold and header, as well as remove all 4 spark plugs and jack the car up so that a gear ratio inspection could be done. We complied with these wishes the Tech Inspectors inspected theses components and we were found COMPLIANT in all areas. The before mentioned car that was found NONCOMPLIANT has nothing to do with Race Engineering nor uses any of our product.

As for the above mentioned question
"How much did it cost Race Engineering for this miscommunication?"
Race Engineering has NEVER bribed or paid monies to ANY Tech official in ANY series. Nor have any Race Engineering cars or customer cars ever been found to be non compliant and have NEVER had been assessed any points, lost any places or had any fines or tech issues.

Race Engineering won the East Coast Pro Miata Championship in 2005, the North American Pro Miata Overall Championship in 2005, the Carolina Pro Cup Spec Miata in 2005, the ARRC Spec Miata in 2005, 4 Spec Miata divisional championships in National competition in 2006 as well as the SARRC Spec Miata in 2006. Through all of these championships and races our cars have been torn down in tech on numerous occasions parts have been confiscated, engines have been confiscated and cars have been impounded and NEVER has there been any compliance issues... period.

I hope this clears up any confusion in regards to these questions. If anyone has any other questions please feel free to give me a call (704) 636-2452..
[/b]


That is a very thorough and professional reply - well said. I'd buy stuff from somebody like you if I ran a Miata.

Cheers,

Ben