Still a place for Toyo RA-1 Proxes in the rain?

[gran racing]

I should start this by stating that I realize there maybe a difference in answers depending upon a driver’s goals. In this scenario, it would be for someone who has a fighting shot at winning a race here and there and wants to be a contender in rainy weather.

I’ve got a set of unshaved Toyo RA-1s that I had bought to be used as my rain tires. At the time, I decided against the “very wet tire” dirt stocker in favor of an intermediate tire and the decision made sense. Now that Hoosier has come out with a tire that can be used in both light rain and heavy rain, I’m re-thinking what I should do. Then again I have yet to use rain tires. (The one time I could have actually used them, I left them at home since the weather “was going to be nice”. Ooops!) If it is not a heavy rain, I would imagine that the new Hoosier tires would do better than the RA-1. In the heavy rain, I would make the same assumption.

[Knestis]

Point of reference - I really LOVE to drive in the wet and I think I'm actually pretty good at it, particularly compared to folks out here in the Mid-Atlantic and SE states...

I used to think that the Toyos were great in the rain, until I tried to chase Chad Slagg around while he was using the new Hoosiers, at a VIR NASA race last year.

http://www.nasaracing.net/VIR_July_05/resu...r%20073105.html (http://www.nasaracing.net/VIR_July_05/results/P%20Legends%20-%20Stinger%20073105.html)

Yeah - he was in an H1 car but power was NOT what made up that 4 seconds he was faster than my FT Toyos, given the number of other more powerful cars that were behind us.

I gots me some new Hoosiers in black bags in the garage, bay-beee. Just waitin'.

K

[Greg Amy]

I tried racing in the rain with the full-tread Toyos against other drivers on Hoosiers, and I got my butt handed to me.

I bought the Hoosiers.

If you want to start the race, the Toyos are fine. But if you want to be competitive, you need the Hoosiers.

[BMW RACER]

Guys.

Are you talking about the new "V" tread Hoosiers? If so how do they hold up on a drying track? Here in Southern California we don't get much rain, the last time I ran on rains it was full dry by the end of the race!

I ran FT Toyos maybe not as quick in real rain as the Hoosiers but they will hold up if things dry out.

Cheers.

[charrbq]

Some people swear by the FT Toyos or etc. for rain, but I agree with Greg, they're fine if you don't want to go really fast enough to win, and don't mind limited control.

I run shaved Kumho's for long enduros or for a wet track. I chose them because I could get them in the size I wanted. But for rain, it's the Hoosier Dirt Stockers. They're about gone, so I will have to go for the new Hoosier rains.

For IT, Hoosier is the closest thing to a full bore racing slick we can get. Shaved street tires are close, at best, but do you come to win, place, show, or play?

[zracre]

I have had good luck with the Toyo's in intermediate conditions...but full rain go with Hoosier. If it is just spitting on and off I usually grab the Toyo's...unless it is the ARRC or something...

[gran racing]

Looks like I need to add Hoosier rain tires to the winter budget.

[JLawton]

Looks like I need to add Hoosier rain tires to the winter budget.
[/b]

Isn't that like putting the cart before the horse?? :D

[gran racing]

LOL! Yeah, just a bit. :D

[chumpy36]

For me, I'm not sure it's worth the expense. I've got FT toyos and I've used them ONCE in two years.

That being said, at the last NASA race at RA there was an Rx-7 on Hoosiers rains and two sm's with ft toyos.

The rain was Murderous. Full downpour, Spec #1 was First overall in the rungroup with a 2:18:4
Second was the RX-7 with hoosiers at 2:18.9 Third SM (me) was at 2:21.

Keep in mind though the session was very short. I suspect all of us would have gone quicker given a few more laps and I bet the hoosiers would have gone much faster.

A side note, the hoosiers apparently are not foolproof as Slagg ended up in the wall with them on (at least I assume they were the hoosier wets)

J

[Greg Amy]

I've got FT toyos and I've used them ONCE in two years.[/b]

It's funny, but if I had to summarize the NE racing this year in one word, it would be: rain.

I've been racing since 1984(?). In that time, prior to this year, I'd been in ONE rain race. Yep, one. This year it seems like every weekend either had rain or the threat of rain. First NHIS even had SLEET! NHIS rain, Pocono rain, Watkins Glen rain, NHIS again.

I bought those full-tread Toyos from a buddy that was leaving Spec Miata, and neer thought I'd use them. After this year I decided to invest in a set of Hoosier rains so I could put them in the baggies and never use them again.

Money well spent, I'd reckon...

[zracre]

I bought those full-tread Toyos from a buddy that was leaving Spec Miata, and neer thought I'd use them. After this year I decided to invest in a set of Hoosier rains so I could put them in the baggies and never use them again.

Money well spent, I'd reckon...
[/b]

The key to no rain is to take them out and show them to the rain gods as you are loading them on your trailer...if you leave them at home it will rain.

[Greg Amy]

Yeesh! I'd never considered that. Should I bring them out of the enclosed trailer every weekend, or is monthly sufficient?

DON'T forget to bring your to Atlanta; I do NOT want to race in the rain there... - GA

[its66]

The key to no rain is to take them out and show them to the rain gods as you are loading them on your trailer...if you leave them at home it will rain.
[/b]
:happy204:

And, if it appears that displaying them to the rain gods doesn't work, pick one of the faster cars in the group to "sacrifice" to said gods by actually mounting the rains on his/her racecar. That will almost always settle the rain gods(unless they have been stirred up by the hurricane gods..in which case..STAY HOME and :birra: )

[DavidM]

Yeesh! I'd never considered that. Should I bring them out of the enclosed trailer every weekend, or is monthly sufficient?

DON'T forget to bring your to Atlanta; I do NOT want to race in the rain there... - GA
[/b]

Good thing you weren't at the February Road Atlanta race. Talk about miserable. The race itself wasn't too bad, but qualifying was horrible. A canoe would've gotten you around the track faster. My first rain race - nothing like trial by fire. I managed to make it through the race in one piece. I was on full-tread Toyos and that was not the tire to have for those conditions. For a full wet race the Hoosier rains would be much better I think. Course I still just have the full-tread Toyos as I just can't justify spending $800 yet on tires that will sit in bags most of the time.

David

[Knestis]

Quit talking about rain, ya bums. It's making me homesick for racing in Seattle. I'm crossing my fingers that I'll draw the last stint at the VIR 13 and it will rain the whole time - at night. Bwah-hah-hah!

K

[charrbq]

Buying rain tires is like buying insurance. You don't want to ever use it,but you buy it just in case. In the mean time, it just sits there...waiting. I bought my rains in 2002 and have used them only once. Actually, I'm anxious to use them again so I won't feel so bad about buying a new set when these have so much tread on them. The one time I used them, they were absolutely mandatory. Nothing I had, nor did anyone else have, in the tire arsenal perform as well or as safe. They go to every race, mounted on the trailer tire rack in plan view of the the rain gods. B)

[FireballPhil]

Chris, did that "one time" happen in Memphis in the March race about 2-3-4 years ago?

I am so glad that you are up and around now. :023:

Phil

[erlrich]

I'm crossing my fingers that I'll draw the last stint at the VIR 13 and it will rain the whole time - at night. Bwah-hah-hah!
K [/b] Kirk, you've probably heard this before (probably more than once :D ), but you're one sick puppy.

The reason I bought the full-tread Toyos earlier this year was that at the time I was using shaved Toyos as dry tires, and I figured I could always get the full-treads shaved later on. Now that I will (hopefully) not be running on Toyos in the dry ever again I am contemplating switching to Hoosier wets for next year. The only thing that makes me hesitate is that I'm not sure what the shelf life of the Hoosiers will be. So far this year I've only put about 5 laps on the Toyos, and that was only because I needed to run a hardship session and didn't have time to change them. I would really hate to spend any more money on rain tires that might dry rot (or even just harden up) before I ever get a chance to use them. I know guys who have told me they have been using the same set of dirt stockers for the past 5, 7, even 10 years. But, you know how racers tend to exaggerate.

So the question is, is it reasonable to assume that a properly cared for set of Hoosier wets will last for at least 5 years? If that's the case I could justify a set, but otherwise I would just have to settle for being slow (I'm getting used to that anyway).

[Jeremy Billiel]

So the question is, is it reasonable to assume that a properly cared for set of Hoosier wets will last for at least 5 years? If that's the case I could justify a set, but otherwise I would just have to settle for being slow (I'm getting used to that anyway).
[/b]

I would think that if you keep them in bags in the trailer and out of the sun they would last a good amount of time. Sun and ozone is what dry rots the tires from what I have been told by tire guys.

[charrbq]

Chris, did that "one time" happen in Memphis in the March race about 2-3-4 years ago?

I am so glad that you are up and around now. :023:

Phil
[/b]
No, but that was the inspiration for their purchase the next month. I was running some other street tires (name withheld) that should've been excellent in the rain. When I came putting around the coffin turn and hit the concrete and slid, helplessly towards the wall at about 10 mph, I decided that their needed to be a change. The body work and the cleaning bill were really scary. I was impressed with the corner worker...he never moved as I came directly for him. I suppose he figured, as slow as I was going, he could stick out his foot and stop me. :happy204:

[tomcattk]

why didn't you just call them about it?

[Dave Ebersole]

I was at the Labor Day MARRS at Summit Point. Saturday morning qualifying was steady rain from the hurricane that made it's way north that week. I paid particular attention to the ITB guys and the Hoosier wet runners were at the front of the grid. In fact, some guys who had no business anywhere near the front were there due to the Hoosiers. The landscape changed a bit Sunday in dry race conditions.

[CaptainWho]

Our driver's school at Roebling back in '04 was almost totally rain. Out of about 16 track sessions, I think we had two or three that were completely dry, another three or four that were partly dry, and three or four that were ungodly downpours. The Dirt Stockers were amazing. I only lost like ten or fifteen seconds a lap, IIRC, and I was greener than grass at the time. I did have to "hunt puddles" in a couple of sessions, though. Ours are about dry rotted, so I'm ordering a new set this month. I guess I need to figure out whether to get the Dirt Stockers or the new Hoosier.