LRP's great improvement "The Widow Maker"

[eprodrx7]

Nice job. Way to make an unsafe corner more dangerous, except for one race a year that is. This is in car vid from labor day MX5 race. I just keep asking myself why does the corner station have to be there?
http://www.over6racing.com/videos/lrp06_crash.wmv

[Jeremy Billiel]

John - I have not driven LRP yet this year, but what is now there that caused the issue in the video? Does the armco protrude out for some reason? The car looked as though it cleared the flag station on the left.

[eprodrx7]

The problem is that the runoff room that was created was not carried all the way up and over the top of the hill. The corner station is still right where it has been for the last 50 years. So the armco comes back to the track almost perpendicular to traffic.

[gran racing]

Way to make an unsafe corner more dangerous, except for one race a year that is. [/b]

How exactly did they make is "more dangerous"? On the bottom of the downhill, they pushed the armco back. This allows some room on the bottom of the hill in case there's an incident or they know they are going in too hard some extra space.

Having a corner worker station on the top of the hill is absolutely necessary. Not sure if you're a driver or not...when on the track going up the hill, the track beyond it is blind. There are often times people who spin after the top of the hill, and the only way oncoming drivers know this is because of the corner workers.

Yeah, it might be nice if there were some extra runoff room, but if it were paved, don't think I (and most other drivers) would then start passing on the outside of that turn. In the end, I'm not sure if this would make things safer.

Personally, the changes they made at lime rock were much nicer than I anticipated. At least some effort to make the track better was made (regardless of the reason why it was done).

[RSTPerformance]

Dave-

I have to disagree with you on this topic... although I wont fully disagree till after this weekends National when I get a look at the track. For me anyplace where a guardrail or jersey barior is perpendicular to the flow of traffic I think it is a MAJOR accident waiting to happen. I know in my car if I needed "extra" runoof room it would be at the flag station, thus I anticipate if/when I crash in the uphill it will be a head on shot into the flag station. Not safe for me or the corner workers.

I will check it out this weekend and get my final thoghts.


Raymond

[gran racing]

Ray, I'm not saying it wouldn't be nice to push the whole guardrail back quite a ways (like turn one at the Glen). My only point was that the track improved safety wise, not the other way around.

Being the silly guy that I am, I still talked with some of the GrandAm guys to see if there were any new passing opportunites with the extended pavement on the bottom of the hill. :unsure: (I haven't driven yet either since the improvements.) Guess not.

[Andy Bettencourt]

I watched the video. Please tell me how this paving of that area 'caused' the driver to hit the armco. Pavement there or not, turning to the outside of that car at speed without slowing would have had the same result.

Now if you wanted to complain that they didn't 'flatten' the armco, then go ahead, but to infer that the extra pavement (which is not racing surface) was somehow the cause of that accident is not true IMHO.

AB

[RSTPerformance]

Andy-

agreed... the car still would have crashed, and in this case, it probably would have been worse the old way...

I am just scared that someone is going to run wide and hit that wall head on at full speed. The old way you at least would have bounced off of it... the car still would be junk yard scrap but it might have been less of an impact... I am speacking though from a FWD experience where you need to keep his foot in it to try and pull through. If you don't make it (such as Matt at NHIS) then it will be a hard hit.

I am not going to argue if it is safer or not, cuase I am sure it is to most, however I think it may have added a new hazard

Raymond "My final judgment will come this weekend when I see it in person!!!" Blethen

[lateapex911]

Wow...Jim went around FAST! And he still won the race? Impressive.

I think Jason (Siani, the driver of the Miata that hit) would have been in doo doo pre OR post modifications. Last year, he would have wiped the side off the car. This year, he nosed it into a unmovable barrier.

Probably more damage this year.

It all depends on the tangent you go off at. Before the changes, nearly any tangent was painful. Now, if you have an issue early corner, you have a lot more room before you hit something, and that something is softer, as there is more room to stack tires 2 or 3 deep as opposed to one deep as before.

But........if you go off on a mid to late corner tangent, you are no longer hitting the barrier side first, as the barrier now has a bit of "catchers mitt" to it. So, you'll stop, as opposed to bounce. More of a head on than a glancing blow.

So, it's a trade off. Better for some crashes, worse for others. IMHO, of course.

[eprodrx7]

As Jake said it's better for some types of as opposed to others. Like it's great for very fast cars approaching the uphill and making a U turn into the chicane. Late apex, much slower, pointed in that direction anyway. For all the rest of us who go straight at the top of the hill it is very bad. I'm not saying that Jason would not have hit the guardrail, but it is the angle of attach that comes into question. Last year it would have been an earlier impact but much more of a glancing blow. Most likely a roughed up door, fender and qtr. and a bent wheel or two but he would have continued. But with the new set up it was an almost head on hit. The car is sliding in that direction and the unprotected rail is perpendicular to the track. Move the rail back, delete the corner station and put a worker on the other side with a control panel that operates a set lights to warn drivers. It can be that simple!

BTW Dave I am a driver, 15+ years, but do not need to be to see the stupidity of the situation.

[16v]

the uphill now seems to mimic the downhill runoff area where the barrier comes back out almost to track side

[gran racing]

and put a worker on the other side with a control panel that operates a set lights to warn drivers. It can be that simple![/b]

Right. It's that simple. ??? :rolleyes: Do I feel safe racing at LRP? If you ask my wife - would you feel safe with me driving to Boston during the week or racing at LRP, racing at LRP would be the safer option.

Interesting how CPTV is airing the LRP video as I speak.

[eprodrx7]

Actually Dave I was watching the LRP thing also! I'm in it to. About ten minutes in you see a group of prod cars go by, I'm driving the RX7.

Anyway I really do think it could be that easy. If the French can get the Airbus 300 to fly I think we can get a set of lights to work probably faster then using a flag. We use them at Pocono, WGI and Summit. What is the great hurdle?

In reference to the fatal accident last year, I'm not sure what it has to do with this discussion. Yes it happened on the uphill but from reports that I heard the poor guy in the Radical just didn't see the flags. Workers at the bottom and the top of the hill had them flying high. What ever the reason, driving over his head, red mist, irresponsibility, lack of vision, or poor judgment, track design or worker communication would not have changed a thing.

BTW in Jason's accident he to came to rest in the middle of the track also. He had been running second at the time and thankfully the entire field -1 was able to avoid him.

[gran racing]

O.k. John, you're right. (No, I'm not being sarcastic.) My mind primarily jumped to what it would take pollitically within the town to get this accomplished and not what it would take to physically make the change. The financial end of things also came to mind.

[Greg Amy]

I'd suggest a lot of you guys just sit back until you see it for yourself. I have.

The first time I saw it was at a PDA event in March; while I was riding around in the right seat of a slower car admiring the changes to the track, I was surprised - and skeered - when I saw it for the first time. That wall is pretty much perpendicular to the direction of travel at that point. I remembered saying to myself, "if someone goes off there, that's gonna leave a mark." When I just watched the video from the guy's MX-5 (and I was there at the event to see the end result in the pit lane) it simply supported my initial impressions.

To a "T", anyone I've talked to that has seen it thinks the same thing: that's a very dangerous guardrail.

Now, it's certainly in a location that is a very unlikely place to go off; most folks will end up straight off from missing their braking point, and others tend to go off more downstream from spinning at the crest. In fact, when I looked at it later in the PDA day I thought that "yeah, it's a bad wall, but it's not really in a likely impact location."

Surprise! The first major race weekend there and guess what happens...?

I drove LRP for the first time at speed yesterday during the test day. I simply blocked that wall out (mentally and visually), 'cause you're just going too fast there to really notice it. However, just as you saw from within Siani's car, just 'cause you don't see it don't mean it ain't there... - GA

[LD71]

I've done a lot of laps at Lime Rock already this year with the new uphill, and some instructing too. I've looked at that corner from many angles, and talked to some Grand Cup guys about it Memorial Day.

The changes are an improvement at the downhill, but the increase in runoff at the bottom creates the illusion that it funnels even more at the top than before; it's not any narrower at the top, it's just wider at the bottom. There is some room there before teh guardrail and worker's station, but not much.

If you go off drivers left at the updill and several other places at LRP, The tendency is to want to turn hard right to get back on the track---I saw this with a Masearti Gran Sport driver in March at the uphill (big $ at teh body shop), a Grand Cup car at yestedy's test day, and you can see it in the video. the consequesnces are similar, you have to be lucky not to hit anything, usually it's a hard hit.

The driver in the video has experience, but I don't think he's been at LRP much if at all (I could be wrong, no mater how much experience you have, mistakes happen---I've made too many myself). If he hadn't tried to horse it back on when he did, he could have rode it out---wouldn't have been pretty on tape, but the car still would be.

Yesterday Ben Phillips (sp?) had a suspensiion failure in his SPU car at the bottom of the hill and told me he hit straight in at over 100 mph. He's ok, but lots of damage. Would have been much worse last year.

I think the changes are an improvement. The funneling illusion is something to watch out for. As is the driver school lesson not to try to horse the car back on if you go off.

Larry DuLude
LD71 :D

[benspeed]

I was amazed when I watched that video - nearly the exact same place my car hit. When I was driving home and replaying the crash in my mind I kept asking myself if the barrier had changed up at the top. The barrier had nothing to do with my cars suspension failure, but if the barrier had been about 4-5 feet away from the track my catastrophic wreck would have been a big spinout.

Car is just incredibly torn up - neck, back, shoulders not doing so great either. Glad I was wearing a HANS and that I had pulled the belts extra tight. I cannot imagine what this might have been like at the downhill.

After 6 months of hard work and some big $$...... what a huge disappointment. I am waiting to call the shop who did the work - I need to take a paxil before I call. :mad1: :mad1: :mad1:

Car is very fast (or was).

[lateapex911]

Ben, sorry to hear about that! Man..that car hasn't been an easy road, has it?? Come back to IT!

Larry, if I hear you right, you're cool with the change. I'm cool with the change at the bottom, but very Un cool with the change at the top. Richard Petty used to run high around lots of tracks...said he liked it because he had less room before he hit the wall, and the angle was a lot better up there...scratches to the door, not flattened front ends.

I am sure they had their reasons for moving the lower section back, but leaving the upper section as is, and transitioning with the rail that is at such a bad angle. But now, even at this early season juncture, we're getting real data that suggests whatever those reasons we're, they couldn't have been good enough.

Please move the flag station back in line with the rest of the guardrail, Lime Rock!

[LD71]

Jake,
I will take anothe look this weekend, perhaps I am wrong about it only being an illusion of funneling.

I looked at the video again, sure would like to be able to slo-mo that. The "out of bounds" on drivers left dips, and I wonder if this did not add to Jason's problems---you can see him go opposite lock during the video. I'm sure the drop-off is there to discourage using the off-course section as part of the track---as I've seen some cars do anyway.

I believe the flag station would be tough to move, as others have said, but maybe that's the ultimate solution.

Larry DuLude
LD71 :D

[Doc Bro]

I wonder why LRP doesn't move the flag station back toward West Bend and raise it. Similar to the tree house at NHIS. The line of sight would be the same, it would give additional guard rail options and the flaggers would be safer. Is it because of that Nissan? GTP? flip when it got air at the hill? Or is it because the flaggers need quick access to the track? Or is it because I'm a genius and the only one to think of that?!!??


R

[Andy Bettencourt]

Or is it because I'm a genius and the only one to think of that?!!??


R [/b]

You really want me to answer this? :D :P :D

AB

[Greg Amy]

Rob, the line of sight for the worker station is perfect for that corner. Anything farther down and you won't catch it until you start to climb the hill, if not later.

Just move the station back and flatten out the wall there.

[RSTPerformance]

I wonder why LRP doesn't move the flag station back toward West Bend and raise it. Similar to the tree house at NHIS. The line of sight would be the same, it would give additional guard rail options and the flaggers would be safer. Is it because of that Nissan? GTP? flip when it got air at the hill? Or is it because the flaggers need quick access to the track? Or is it because I'm a genius and the only one to think of that?!!??
R
[/b]

I would like to see a flag station at the same spot (top of the hill drivers left) only 5' or so back from the track so that thier is not a wall perpendicular to our racing surface, and so that the flaggers have quick access to the track when needed.

I am not sure how I feel about that "tree house" station at NHIS, I corner worked for a day by myself (very lonely up their) in that thing and I didn't walk away with the best experience... Cold, windy and not really in a great spot to respond to someone if need be. Although it might be a cool spot for some photo's someday!!!

My initail opinion (again only viewing from this video and from previose pictures) is that the "new" Lime Rock is A LOT SAFER for the "pro" cars that run the chicane, however it might need some work for us regional guys... All in all though it IS a step in the right direction.

[Greg Amy]

I made the following two quick drawings to illustrate what I perceive as the changes at LRP and how they can affect impacts. PLEASE NOTE these are NOT to scale, are NOT engineering drawings, and could very damn well be off base, but this is what it looks like from the car and that video.

Drawing 1 is what the corner USED to look like.

Drawing 2 is the change they made.

Compare them and see what you think. - GA

[RSTPerformance]

Greg and others...

I will be at Lime Rock this weekend... I will try to get some shots on a camera that show the corner a bit better than this video... When I see it if I feel it isn't safe I will bring it to the attention of the Safety Stewards so that the club can give feedback to Lime Rock managment, should they agree with me.

Hope you all have a good weekend, and if your at the Lime Rock Natinal be sure to say hi, I will nice and dry learning in my role as an "SIT" up in the tower :)

Raymond

[lateapex911]

Rob, it's the latter, of course!!!!!

But seriously folks, ba da bump!

Greg, your drawings are crude, but effectively what it is in reality.

I bet the real reason that we see the result is that IMSA/ALMS stated the standards they required to race there, and that if those standards were not met, no racing would happen. I also bet thay had a completion date in the contract, AND a site inspection was carried out to confirm.

I also bet that ALMS thinks the situation is fine, as they use the chicane, if I'm not mistaken, which changes the dynamics of the corner significantly.

Lime Rock, I think, could have gone further and pulled the station back, but at considerable extra effort, and expense. Who knows, it might have been requested initially by IMSA, but 'negotiated' out by LRP in their efforts to save/make money. But I don't think it was part of the ALMS requirements, and it didn't get done.

Just a guess on my part though.

[disquek]

Would another option be to just make the flagger station a little smaller?

-Kyle

[16v]

Although it might be a cool spot for some photo's someday!!!
[/b]

I investigated this last season. There's not enough room up there for the worker to do there thing and for another person to hang out and shoot pix. I even toyed with mounting a camera and doing a remote shot..

[Wreckerboy]

Agreed, that new design is not A Good Thing. Would stacking tires in front of the Armco where it (now) is perpendicular to travel help any?

[Magical Trevor]

Agreed, that new design is not A Good Thing. Would stacking tires in front of the Armco where it (now) is perpendicular to travel help any?
[/b]

Perhaps...

Either way, that is what has been done (as of this weekend's National).

[RSTPerformance]

After looking at the turn it is far safer than it once was... It saved a few cars this weekend... which is good!!! :happy204:

It is however an area of concern by many people (including myself) due to the potential to be more dangerouse in an accident especially for higher speed cars such as GT1 or FA. Us IT guys should not have an issue, but the potential is certainly thier.

The track is aware of the concerns from what I understand. I believe that they are looking at options to make the turn even more safe!!! Maybe Mike will chime in and give us an update?

Raymond

[kevin22]

I disagree, I think by extending the runoff where they did, they have made it safer for the fast cars the have to brake into the uphill. But for the slower IT cars and Miata's that barely brake, we run into trouble on the exit, and the new angle of the wall is not the solution I had hoped for.

[eprodrx7]

Report from the national is that the widow maker (WM) claimed three more cars this weekend. All were miatas. One in qual. and two in the race with collateral damage to a third car following the two that wrecked in the race. Seems that the one in qual. was all by himself and just got wide on the exit. He tagged the WM and it directed the car back into traffic. In the Miata race two went in side by side with room for one, slight contact then the outside car into the WM hard enough to bounce off and collect the other. Then both cars slid across the track in front of traffic and slightly tagging a third car. Only the third car finished. Thanks LRP for making things safe

[RSTPerformance]

Report from the national is that the widow maker (WM) claimed three more cars this weekend. All were miatas. One in qual. and two in the race with collateral damage to a third car following the two that wrecked in the race. Seems that the one in qual. was all by himself and just got wide on the exit. He tagged the WM and it directed the car back into traffic. In the Miata race two went in side by side with room for one, slight contact then the outside car into the WM hard enough to bounce off and collect the other. Then both cars slid across the track in front of traffic and slightly tagging a third car. Only the third car finished. Thanks LRP for making things safe
[/b]


Lots of Miata's only taken by the wall... hummm interesting and yet suprising as the Miata's were the cleanest sessions from what I saw....

My understanding from what I herd was that the "new uphill" saved those cars from major damage. If it was still set up in the old configuratin those cars would not have driven away, however with the new configuration I think that all of the cars drove away and were able to continue thier session if they had wnated?

John would it be feasible to get those drivers names? and oppinions on how the wall made thier specific accidents worse? Not interested in 2nd or 3rd person interprettions, would like to hear it first hand from those drivers.

I have to admit I still feel that A LOT needs to be done to make the turn as safe as it SHOULD be however they did make improvments for 90% - 95% of the incidents in the uphill.

Raymond

[benspeed]

Here's a point of reference for bad days on the race track - estimate to repair my SPO car after tangling with the Widow Maker - $9,500.00. I might be running a VERY limited season the rest of this year. Somebody send me a lottery ticket. (Add on top of that the $3K setup from the lousy shop that put together a suspension that lasted half a lap) :bash_1_:

Anybody topping that from the ITA carnage at NHIS?

[JLawton]

Anybody topping that from the ITA carnage at NHIS?
[/b]

Wow, sorry to hear the news Ben. Although my bill from NHIS wasn't that much, I am doing all the work myself. Have about 30 hours into it already and maybe another 20 to go..............Of course, if I knew what I was doing, it would only take half the time!!

Let that friggen SPO car sit and take the RX7 out. Don't you know, IT is where it's at!!

[benspeed]

I sold the Mazda! I am without a racing fix right now. These NASCAR guys don't fool around - sounds like they'll have this thing ready in about a week.

Hope that ITA Saturn comes back faster than before!

Cheers,

bp

[theracinglawyer]

Some things to consider. The name of the new improvement "the widow maker" doesn't sound good to me. The videos of the impact with this widow maker in the SM qualifer is frighting. I will be sending the video of the SM qualifying accident with "the widow maker" to LRP. SCCA and the Connecticut state Police as they regulate racing. If they can order LRP to fill pot holes Im sure they can investigate the "the widow maker"and it safety concerns.

You do not want to make a direct hit on it as it is the same as a telephone pole in the middle of the track, you're going to get hurt.

I hope they don't wait till someone is killed to act.

[lateapex911]

Mike, lets say we leave the cops out of it until we feel that it's really required, eh??

Better to show respect and work thru chnannels than sick the cops on them, IMO..

[gran racing]

I totally agree. Wheither we agree with the changes, the track made an attempt to make it safer. Approaching the track nicely, and in a non-threatening manner should be the first step.

[theracinglawyer]

Dave and Jake.

I wiill follow your suggestion but I always say that unless you have authority behind you, you lack the full power of your argument. When we deal with the state in defective design cases wher someone is killed or injured, notice is the most important thing. The more letters we get from racers,fans, officials the better we stand a chance at revisions. So lets write, it could save your life or you best friend's.

I would love to know the architect that made the changes. Usually they are good and sometimes the client doesn't follow their advise.In that case you have economics as the reason.

I'll let you know what happens.

Im still reeling from Doctor Zimmermen's death at the uphill at LRP last year. He was a good buddy and every time I go there I think of him.Life is so special I want to do all I can to perserve it as best I can. (Sorry for the rant)

[StephF]

Let's not forget, shall we, that the track is still and all private property. If they decide they don't want us there, we're gone. :(
And don't you think for one second that we are bullet proof and invincible just because we've been there forever. If we come at them swinging, then don't overlook the fact that they have the right to stop SCCA from racing there, and could very well do so.
We ALL want a safe, fun place to race. Coming at them with threats of calling the CTSP, or worse, letting it get to the stage of talking of lawsuits and lawyers, will NOT improve anything for anybody. Especially when the CTSP probably signed off on the design of the uphill in the first place.
I'm sorry you lost your friend. It's a terrible blow, and would hurt anyone. But approaching this situation by involving the police is detrimental to all. Keep it within the channels, and see what response we get. I'm betting that they will be much more amenable to suggestions than demands.

[lateapex911]

Most heartily agreed Steph! For those not in the know, LRP has been a long time friend of the SCCA racer, but, honestly, times have changed, and they are very accutely aware of money. Multiple personale changes at the track have reduced the institutional memory. Making profits and cutting losses is paramount in their minds. Our events cost the most, and are the biggest headaches from what I understand.

Recently, the track promised to help reduce certain costs that were associated with the rental. From my understanding, in the end, those costs weren't attended to as hoped. Current rent for a weekend at the track now costs SCCA NER in the range of $44,000, or thereabouts.

The track has, by all reports, clubs clamoring for dates. Their allegance is of course to pro dates, and they have jumped thru hoops courting NASCAR for the Busch Series races. IMSA is the reason for the safety changes in the first place.

I am NOT a fan of playing bully and threatening in this case. The response might very well be to rent the track to clubs using stricter 13/13 racing rules...for lesser fees, but greatly reduced headaches. As it is our schedule is being eroded steadily, and if the proposed injunction modification becomes permanent, more dates will be lost ...to us.

I do not think the SCCA is in the position to throw it's weight around right now.

I might be wrong, but it's one of those thin ice deals, once it's broken, it's impossible to go backwards...you're in trouble.

I would be interested in hearing from parties more closely associated with the actual relationship between the track management and the club management before I went further at the very least.

[lateapex911]

Wow...just got back from the Regional/Drivers school at Lime Rock, and the legend grows.

The "widow maker" played a roll again this weekend. I'll let those involved post the facts, but, just to get rumours flowing..(kidding!), I'll sum it up-

1- I was told about a Miata that struck the new tire barrier in front of the station and went up and "over the fence". No injuries that I am aware of...although the flaggers were no doubt spooked!

2- The qualifying sessions were held in wet conditions. Which means, as many know, a lot of very unique driving lines at Lime Rock. One particular car in ITA was protested by the corner flag captain at the uphill for dangerous driving, and I understand a counter protest was entered. I understand the protested driver felt he was driving the track the same way he did last year, (in the rain) although another witness felt differently. I didn't hear about the protest results, but the driver started the race in his as qualified grid position, which would suggest it wasn't upheld, or there was no sanction.

So far, the evidence does seem to suggest an alarming increase in the severity of incidents at that corner.

[16v]

[attachmentid=468]the corner in question from today

[observer]

I was at LRP the day the last fatality happend. Anytime a driver leaves us, as a few drivers who I grew up with have, it always has and will continue to be dreadful. However, a big however, is that you must not place the blame on a racetrack like Limerock. If there are responses, I will expand on this topic.
Never forget, there isn't an event in the country, at any level, that waivers must be signed first. There is a reason for that.
If the circuit you are entering an event at is felt to be unsafe to you, that's not a problem, simply do not sign and turn around.

[Tkczecheredflag]

Wow...just got back from the Regional/Drivers school at Lime Rock, and the legend grows.

The "widow maker" played a roll again this weekend. I'll let those involved post the facts, but, just to get rumours flowing..(kidding!), I'll sum it up-

2- The qualifying sessions were held in wet conditions. Which means, as many know, a lot of very unique driving lines at Lime Rock. One particular car in ITA was protested by the corner flag captain at the uphill for dangerous driving, and I understand a counter protest was entered. I understand the protested driver felt he was driving the track the same way he did last year, (in the rain) although another witness felt differently. I didn't hear about the protest results, but the driver started the race in his as qualified grid position, which would suggest it wasn't upheld, or there was no sanction.

[/b]
I was the ITA dirver that was protested. The protest was for driving off the race line in an unsafe manner.

First I want to say that I hold SCCA in the highest regard. In short I love this club. My roots in SCCA stem from F&C - I flagged for 4 years before I set foot into a race car in 1997. I am incredibly grateful for all the volunteers that make our events safe and fun, second to none are the Corner Workers - You guys (the unisex version of guys) are great!! - Thank You for your generosity and time and for keeping us safe. I also want to say that the SOM, Chief, Chair, Driver Rep and all Officals and Stewards who considered the protest were professional and courteous. We have rules that govern us and I beleive they exist, in part, to keep ALL of us safe and hopefully leave room for improvement. Anything I say about the protest is my response, read that as my version, and in no way meant to minimze the process, the outcome, or what happened. I consider this a seriuos issue. Okay?

Anyone who has raced with me at LRP prior to this year knows I love LRP in the rain. Call me sick but rain can be the great equlaizer especcaially if you know, and are comfortable, with the "wet line." In the uphill between Station 7 and 8 I have always run a wide, a drivers side left "wet race line". Many who have seen me think it's a bit carzy- I used to run extremely close to the ARMCO in the uphill (how close? I could touch it with my hand close) - anyone who has tried it knows that it's the safest place on the track in compromising, wet conditions. I must also ad that it is not neccessarily the fastest wet race line but it is the safest. On this section of track I like to place the car just off the "traditonal" racing surface on a section that I will term "run-off" - a section of asphalt that is rough (rougher than the "regular" track surface), and provides tremendous grip. I can't tell you all my secrets about this line, although I will ad that most are afraid to run out there as it is some what intimidating to the driver. I will say that one key for me were the Hoosier Dirt Stockers although now I use the new Molded Rains - a tremendous wet tire (your welcome - I love you too Bob Smart) Keep in mind that this is the area now termed "widow maker" (sexest to say the least), and has now been expanded with additonal new asphalt and a ARMCO extension. - I no way have I used the new asphalt surface or am I an advocate for using the new surface. The surface that I use is the "old" asphalt. On that note I suspect, based on what I have been told, that this great secret will be taken away. That would sadden me because I beleive it would compromise the safest part of the track, the best wet race line at LRP.

Prior to the expansion of this section of track my wet line has never been in question, Due to recent events (read that as wrecks), one as early as this weekend- I beleive the Corner Workers were feeling at risk of injury and this is seemed to be a good "stepping off point" in an effort to correct the problem. In an early session a SM got into trouble and compromised the safety of the corner workers so I completely unsderstand the issue. The workes unfamilar with my line were feeling at risk - that was the issue.

In the end Officals and Stewards did not uphold the protest - No rules were violated. I made it a point to wait until the day was over, and with cold beer in hand, offered my apoligies to the the corener captian and his team for scaring them, trying to reasure them I had the car under control.

I'm not sure what will happen going forward but my hope is this: If a referrence to "white lines" appear in the supps and if LRP re-paints the "white line" in the uphill - paint the line left of the "Old Surface" between the new and old surface leaving the safest part of the track available for racing. Whatever we need to do in an effort to keep the Corner Workers safe - DO IT.

Happy Fathers Day to all the Dad's - God Bless the Mom's for making it happen - It's great to be a Dad.