Hondata?

[R2 Racing]

Since the Hondata s100 system fits inside the stock ECU box it should be legal for IT, right? Has anyone used one on their IT Honda? Any results? I need to find something to do with these computers but I don't want the guessing of plug and play chips.

Sorry if this has been covered before - the search function on this site leaves something to be desired.

Thanks,

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Kevin
R2 Racing - bright orange racecars!
'85 ITC Civic S
'92 ITC Civic Cx - comming soon to a track near you!
'94 ITS Prelude Si

[Richy Gonzalez]

I would have to say yes to the legality of Hondata systems since "it's within the original ecu casing". However, having experience with other chip/car manufactures, I have a problem with Honda ecu mods from companies that don't give any real results (gains?) other than force induction. For example, if you where dealing with VW and Audi, manufactures give you real numbers (torque/hp?).

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Richy Gonzalez
GB Racing - #24 ITA CRX (http://groups.msn.com/TheGonzalezFamilyRichySheilaandNyah/projectitacrx.msnw)
Racecar Sponsor: LAMIN-X Protective Films (http://www.lamin-x.com)

[davew]

Hondata does not make chips, they make tuning systems. You supply the chips. Therefore any "real results" will be dependent on the tuner working the system and writing the maps. Honda ecus are pretty efficient from the factory, but are tuned to compromise between performance and fuel economy with big considerations for emissions. Any tuning system, hondata or other, which allows you to fully remap the a/f and ignition curves to maximize performance over economy and clean air will allow you to realize "real results" particulary when implemented with consideration for your particular setup. Hondata is an excellent product, I have used it for many years on many different applications. If they did the proper OBD-0 apps I would certainly have one in my 88 CRX. They do have applications for your cars though R2, and I would highly recomend trying them out...especially w/ the datalogging features.

Zdyne is another alternative and they do have obd-0 apps.

please feel free to email me if you have specific technical questions about any of these systems.

dave w

[Chris Wire]

Don't forget the other issue of legality is that it must use the factory wiring harness to fully comply with the rule. If that is not the case then it doesn't matter whether it fits in the case or not. It would be illegal.

This just reinforces the problems that arise when a rule is written poorly. If the rule had stated something like "software may be modified but the hardware must remain stock" then all these discussions about stuffing Motec/Hondata/Zdyne into the factory ECU case would not be necessary.

I doubt we'll be able to put this genie back in the bottle. http://Forums.ImprovedTouring.com/it/frown.gif

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Chris Wire
Team Wire Racing
ITS Mazda RX7 #35
[email protected]

[davew]

Both Hondata & Zdyne use the factory wiring and factory hardware. not just the boxes.

dave w

[Richy Gonzalez]

DaveW,
First, I have no experience with Hondata or Zdyne. I've used GIAC, Superchips, Neuspeed, AutoAuthority and AMS replacement or add-on chips with VW, Audi, BMW and Fords before. I can honestly tell you that I knew what I was getting for the money before I ordered them. No special tunning (dyno runs) was required to make the car perform better than stock. In lots of cases, you lost overall hp but gain considerable torque with a more aggressive fuel curve. The average joe could "feel" the difference.

Now, having that as a background I looked at Hondata and Zdyne and I'm not getting the same results. What I'm getting is a engine management system for you to take the car to a tunner and tune the car for you, which I think is a great product. However, it doesn't justify the cost for my 89 ITA CRX.

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Richy Gonzalez
GB Racing - #24 ITA CRX (http://groups.msn.com/TheGonzalezFamilyRichySheilaandNyah/projectitacrx.msnw)
Racecar Sponsor: LAMIN-X Protective Films (http://www.lamin-x.com)

[Chris Wire]

If I were in the market (which I'm not), I would simply ask myself a few questions:

a) Does Tom Fowler use one?

B) Could I beat Tom Fowler if I had one?

If the answer to both of those questions is "Yes" then grab your wallet and spend away. If not, I'd suggest saving your money. http://Forums.ImprovedTouring.com/it/smile.gif

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Chris Wire
Team Wire Racing
ITS Mazda RX7 #35
[email protected]

[lb2]

Hello guys !!! Tom Fowler did not use one in his CRX but he used some sort of extra ECU on his Prelude ITS car, I have heard that he was testing a Zdyne system in a Civic ITA but I don't know what was the results on the Dyno.

By the way I have bought an ITA VW 16V that I will be running next weekend at Sebring or Road Atlanta depending on the weather in Atlanta ( not going to drive 9 hours to run all weekend in the rain at RA ).

Also I have a Hondata system that I bought for my EP Delslo sorry Delsol http://Forums.ImprovedTouring.com/it/smile.gif and I will be taking it to Miami to the Hondata Dealer in couple weeks for installation and tuning on the Dyno, I will post the results and let you know guys.

Dave W., I will be sending by UPS a software update that we talked about few weeks ago.

Junkman, call me I lost my Cel Phone and lost your number.

Louis B.

[B Breon]

Having tried the Zdyne on a Dyno for about 15-20 pulls, I can tell you that it really is made for a Forced Induction application instead of our NA applications. The Zdyne allows you to create maps for positive intake pressures under forced induction on a stock Honda ECU. But, to tune for a NA performance application, it requires you to work in bands of 500-800 rpm. This is too large of a band in my experience with it to be able to fine tune. The Honda ECU takes the settings above and below the RPM you are at and interpolates the proper fuel and timing, at that large of a band, it was hard to fine tune. At $1000 for the ECU and all the dyno time to tune, it really isn't worth it for the small amount of HP you might be able to eek out, IMHO. Also, HP drops as you get to the rev limit, raising the rev limit doesn't get you anything, at least not for us. Now, keep in mind, I am knowledgeable on ECU programming, but far from the expert. Your results may differ, but I think seat time would be more valuable.



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Brent Breon
Cendiv ITA #26
www.360racing.com

[davew]

Brent,

if Zydyne is 500-800 rpms, what is the granularity of the stock ECU program?

-davew

[B Breon]

Originally posted by davew:
Brent,

if Zydyne is 500-800 rpms, what is the granularity of the stock ECU program?

-davew

The 500-800 rpm was a guess from memory, I have since returned the unit to its owner. As far as I understand the granularity of the Zdyne is the same as the stock. I would think that you would need finer granularity (is this really a word) in order to fine tune for a sizable HP increase.