Newby

[Grumpa]

I have just bought a 79 ITC Rabbit. The car is behind, developmentwise, in regards to suspension, motor, etc, ad infinitum. I will be running in CenDiv at MidOhio, IRP, Gingerman, etc.

1)Springs - rates & lengths, Eibach or Hyper.
2)Ride height - minimum or ?
3)Suspension bushings - stock, poly, teflon?
4)Tires - Hoosier, Toyo, Kuhmo, ?
5)Sway bars - rates
6)Bosch CIS - pressure?
7)Computer chip - stock or aftermarket?
8)Motor - is it possible to build my own 1.6 or better to farm this out?
9)How rampant is the "creative interpretation" of the rulebook?
10)Any other area not mentioned above

Thanks, and God bless all racers.

[SamITC85]

For springs you are going to get many different ideas. On mine I run 650 in the front and 350 in the rear though i was going to go to 400 at least. Brand doesn't make a difference too much.
Ride Height- As low as you can go keeping the lower A arms parallel to the ground any lower will hurt your handling.
Suspension bushings- If you want to spend the money go with the teflon coated bushings, if not Delrin or Poly are pretty close with Delrin being a bit better.
Tires- If you want speed go with the Hoosiers or Goodyears. 185 60R 13 will fit the best for the Hoosiers, the 205 rub on the spring perch without a decent size spacer. Goodyear makes a 195 which will fit. hoosier gets a little better life but the Goodyears are marginally faster. Toyo, and Kumho are good if you are looking for long lasting a decent speed.
Saw bars- Do yourself a favor and order two of the the Shine Racing services tubular bars for the rear and one of there lower stress bars for the front, thats all you'll need
Motor- It is a toss up and depends on how good of a motor you can build, I can't build a good one and bought one from SRS best money I ever spent.
Other recommendations are camber plates in the front and spherical bearing uppers shock mounts in the rear.
Most of this stuff I got from Shine and I have no complaints great service and very helpful. If you have anyother questions please feel free to email me at [email protected]

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Sam Rolfe
TBR Motorsports
#85 ITC VW Rabbit
#85 GP Scirocco on the way
#11 GP Scirocco on the way

[This message has been edited by SamITC85 (edited March 19, 2003).]

[racer_tim]

As long as everything still works, just drive the damn thing. Work on seat time first, then go-fast parts 2nd.

A couple things to add from what Sam said.

Diff and R&P. Get some kind of limited slip diff or go with a spool or welded diff. Anything is better than an open diff.

Tires. Since you run the 13" rim, consider getting some take off Spec Racer Yok's. The rears are 205x60x13 and they will last quite a while. The Toyo's will also last quite a while. Shave them to 4/32's and keep a full tread set for wets.

You also might want to consider the rear shim kit, so you can get 2 degrees negative camber in the rear.

Build your own motors at first. Anybody can do a 1" port into the head and manifold. Balance EVERYTHING (crank, rods, pistons, clutch, flywheel)

Get a baffled oil pan and a high capacity pump. Just remember that the #3 rod bearing is the last device in the loop, so that bearing will spin first. Trust me, I know.

Hawk Blue pads

Replace the front hub bearings at least once a year. I carry a spare set (full hub assembly) with me all the time.

Oil cooler is a must on these VW motors.

Bosch CIS FI. Leave it alone. If it's not broke don't fix it.

Have fun




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Tim Linerud
San Francisco Region SCCA
#95 LP GP Wabbit
http://linerud.myvnc.com/racing/index.html

[This message has been edited by racer_tim (edited March 19, 2003).]

[This message has been edited by racer_tim (edited March 19, 2003).]

[nascarvw]

Hey there,
Great to see a new guy running a VW!
I've had very good luck with the guys over at BSI RACING.
Give them a call, I'm sure they have everything you would ever want for your VW.
www.bsiracing.com (http://www.bsiracing.com)

good pictures too.
GOOD LUCK

[racer14itc]

Originally posted by Grumpa:
I have just bought a 79 ITC Rabbit. The car is behind, developmentwise, in regards to suspension, motor, etc, ad infinitum. I will be running in CenDiv at MidOhio, IRP, Gingerman, etc.

1)Springs - rates & lengths, Eibach or Hyper.
2)Ride height - minimum or ?
3)Suspension bushings - stock, poly, teflon?
4)Tires - Hoosier, Toyo, Kuhmo, ?
5)Sway bars - rates
6)Bosch CIS - pressure?
7)Computer chip - stock or aftermarket?
8)Motor - is it possible to build my own 1.6 or better to farm this out?
9)How rampant is the "creative interpretation" of the rulebook?
10)Any other area not mentioned above

Thanks, and God bless all racers.

Here are my opinions on this as well. I'm building an ITC Rabbit, and after 6 years of racing an ITC Scirocco I'll add the following:

#1. Start with softer, and then work towards stiffer rates as you get comfortable with the car.

#2. Depends on the tire choice. What I found was that the static roll center liked to be on the ground. With a 225/45-13 tire, this meant that the inner pickup point on the front control arm was about 1/2"-3/4" below the ball joint. If you run a different tire, this will change. I've run as much as a 1" split depending on the tire.

#3. Poly or Delrin are fine. Heims are better, but much more expensive.

#4. Get some Toyos in the 185/60 size. They'll give good grip and last forever. When you're ready to go fast, bolt on a set of Hoosiers and let 'er rip!

#5. Most guys in the Southeast run the OPM sway bar, usually the 1" size. Combine this with a stock GTI bar, and you'll have plenty of rear roll stiffness. If you're lifting the rear more than a little bit in the corners (ask your crew or the guy following you!), you've got too much rear roll stiffness.

#6. Get a CIS fuel pressure test kit and check the system and control pressures. If they're within the stock specifications, leave it alone and race it. There is a little bit of HP to be found by fiddling with the CIS, but you're just as likely to lose horsepower (or an engine).

#7. Didn't know these cars came with a chip.

#8. A pro built motor will make more horsepower, and no they won't tell you how! Otherwise, build a solid motor and get the suspension/driver sorted out first!

#9. Depends. The guys running up front at the ARRC are legit. Most cheating goes on in the midpack, where talent seems to be lacking.

#10. Don't fool with a 5 speed. Get a good 4 speed, put a Quaife in it and be done. The 5 speed R&P will cost a fortune, you'll start breaking 5th gears, and/or you'll trash a motor with the dreaded "4-3 upshift". I've seen it done many times (both broken 5th gears and the missed upshift to 5th). Just make sure your 4 speed has the 1.29 third gear, and not the 1.37 (unless you're planning on racing at Summit Point or Kershaw).

No one has mentioned rear toe-in. Most of time I'd recommend 1/16" toe-in on each side in the rear. Some guys will run zero or a touch of toe-out, but that's for the brave of heart!

Also, I'd recommend an ACCUSUMP for the VW's. Even with a good baffled pan (Schrick or trap door type) I've seen oil pressure fluctuate in certain types of turns. And you can't run the oil level higher to compensate because then you'll just whip it into a froth and your oil temps will skyrocket.

Just my opinions of course... http://Forums.ImprovedTouring.com/it/biggrin.gif

Mark Coffin
#14 GP VW Scirocco
#44 ITC Rabbit ... coming soon!
#14 ITC Scirocco... retired.

[Bill Miller]

First off, welcome to the crazy world of racing a VW!! Second, you've gotten some great advice here, I'll see if I can add to it.

1)Springs - rates & lengths, Eibach or Hyper.

As was said, brand is not much of a concern. I run 8" 650F/425R. I like the setup and it works for me. As someone else pointed out, start a bit softer and work up.

2)Ride height - minimum or ?

No more than 3/4" ball joint above inner pivot point.

3)Suspension bushings - stock, poly, teflon?

If you've got the money, go w/ the spherical bearings. I'd wait though, and put the extra $$ into seat time. BSI sells a nice set of Delrin bushings that aren't too expensive. Stay away from Teflon as it will cold-flow on you.

4)Tires - Hoosier, Toyo, Kuhmo, ?

As has been said, Toyos are a great 'starter' tire. They'll last a long time, and will have pretty much the same grip throughout their entire life.

5)Sway bars - rates

I subscribe to the 'no front bar, mega rear bar philosophy. I've got 2 bars in the rear. I take one off for wet races.

6)Bosch CIS - pressure?

As Mark said, check it, and leave it alone if it's w/in spec.

7)Computer chip - stock or aftermarket?

Not sure what you're going to put the chip in? http://Forums.ImprovedTouring.com/it/biggrin.gif

8)Motor - is it possible to build my own 1.6 or better to farm this out?

Building your own motor is not hard. It takes patience, and some specialty tools, but you'll learn some stuff in the process. You can buy a pro-built motor for ~$2500 + core. I think BSI was doing rebuilds for ~$1500.

9)How rampant is the "creative interpretation" of the rulebook?

No comment.

10)Any other area not mentioned above

Seat time, seat time, seat time. You'll get more from this than you will from just throwing money at the car. Also, find another experinced VW racer in your area and see if they'd take your car out for a few laps during a 'test and tune' day. If you've never raced a VW, it's a little hard to know which way to go to correct/change some things.

Good luck!



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MARRS #25 ITB Rabbit GTI
SCCA 279608