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Scott Malbon
10-12-2004, 05:53 PM
I'm thinking seriously about data acquisition. A lot of $$ for my racing budget but perhaps a good investment. Any advice or lessons learned would be appreciated.

Scott

David Ferguson
10-12-2004, 08:20 PM
Our company, Veracity Racing Data, sponsor a forum with discusion about all sorts of data acquistion questions. You may want to go read some of the older posts there. Here's the link:
Data Acquisition Forum (http://p081.ezboard.com/fs2racingfrm4)

I have also put some of my own thoughts into a webpage on our company site: Why use Data Acquisition? (http://veracitydata.com/NewFiles/datawhy.html)

Data Systems are great for answering questions. Sometimes the hard part is coming up with the questions you want to ask. For example, a data system can answer the question "Driver X is faster in my car than me, where is he faster?", but can't always answer "How can I go 1 second faster to catch the next car?"

I could write more, but check out those links, there's lots of good information there already. Got questions? I'll be glad to answer either on the other forum or here.

[This message has been edited by David Ferguson (edited October 12, 2004).]

[This message has been edited by David Ferguson (edited October 12, 2004).]

924Guy
10-13-2004, 08:54 AM
I just started using a data system this year. Over the course of the season, which was only 3 weekends for me, only 2 of which were at my home track (Waterford Hills), I found over 4 seconds thanks IMO mostly to the data I gathered and analyzed.

I am and continue to be very happy with the system. I'm using an AIM Mychron3 system; mine (Gold Auto XG) cost about $900 plus sensors, but they start at around $400. Supplier:
http://www.motorsports-exchange.com/store.htm#aim

A very important part when shopping is to consider the software available for analysis. I work with in-vehicle data acqusition and analysis at work, and AIM's software stands up extremely well in comparison to the "professional" stuff we use at work. I can't comment on other manufacturer's systems or software, though - just be sure to try it out before you buy it.

Next test planned for the system will be the Last Chance Enduro at the Glen - 3 drivers in 3 hrs. Two of the 3 drivers in my car (2-car team) will be novices to the Glen, myself included. It's going to be very interesting when we all run through the car and compare data after practice, before the race, to see how the Mychron system will allow us to come up to speed and compare our technique. http://Forum.ImprovedTouring.com/it/smile.gif

Hope that helps... feel free to email direct with questions: [email protected]

------------------
Vaughan Scott
Detroit Region #280052
'79 924 #77 ITA/GTS1
www.vaughanscott.com (http://www.vaughanscott.com)

[This message has been edited by 924Guy (edited October 13, 2004).]

Greg Amy
10-25-2004, 09:48 PM
I just got my first shot at using data acq, this weekend during the 13-hour race.

Evan Webb brought an Action Digital DL1 with him to install in Kirk's Golf III. We used it during the test day, the qualifying and practice, and all through the 13-hour race. We were able to overlay the stints of the drivers and discuss where we were each strong, and see where we were each weak, and make suggestions to each other for improvements. The bottom line is that we all dropped our lap times about *10 seconds* during the test day alone using this information. I managed to lop off *another* 3-4 seconds during qualifying and the race.

I'll have more to say about this tool later, but this has got to be the best learning tool I have *ever* used in my many years of racing. As I told the guys, I feel like I've been given a new religion, been reborn into the Church of DL1 Data Acquisition. I feel like I have to go out and spread the good news to all you electronics-fearing heathens...

Like I said, we'll have more to share later, but this is Real Good Stuff.

GregA

gsbaker
10-26-2004, 09:14 AM
Quick question: Do any, some, or all of these products overlay data onto the driving video?

Gregg

planet6racing
10-26-2004, 09:21 AM
There is one that overlays data onto video, I believe it is the Commander CDS system. I know they are shown in the back of SportsCar in the advertising section... oh wait, I still have it in my history here (I'm starting to shop for something like this):

http://www.competitiondata.com

Be forewarned, though. The video overlay system isn't cheap.

Could someone share a DL1 file with me? I have the software and the demo file from the actiondigital.com site, but it doesn't have the engine connected and I'd really like to see what it does with RPM's and the like.

Also, Vaughn, could you go a little more into detail about the AIM system you have, what you log, and maybe some pictures/snapshots of the data analysis?

------------------
Bill
Planet 6 Racing
bill (at) planet6racing (dot) com

planet6racing
10-26-2004, 09:26 AM
Oh, forgot one other question:

David: since you seem to sell all different systems, which do you think is the best bang for the buck and why? Also, of all the sensors and tricks that these systems can do, what is probably the most helpful? I know the accelerometers will give the g's and that will help explain a lot, but what about things like the wheel speed sensors, linear displacement sensors for suspension tuning, etc? Or, is it just better to stick to the basics and not get too deep into it? (I'm going to read the forum link that you posted today, read the other document yesterday. If this is already covered in that, I'm sorry!)

------------------
Bill
Planet 6 Racing
bill (at) planet6racing (dot) com

gsbaker
10-26-2004, 09:43 AM
Hey Bill, as a member of your crew I strongly recommend we beg/borrow/steal one of these gizmos for the ARRC.

Does anyone rent? Is it possible to get a stripped-down demo for trial?

G

924Guy
10-26-2004, 10:00 AM
Well, the enduro didn't go off as planned; we didn't have more than 30 minutes between practice and race, and due to other issues didn't get the data downloaded in time to review beforehand. We also had major issues during the race leading to an eventual retirement, preventing us from getting much good data. Much work remains to be done on both of those cars.

Anyway. I do have some of the data from that enduro on my website:
http://www.vaughanscott.com/AIM/aim_tracks.htm

I also have some pics of the unit installed in my own car (just used velcro to pop it into the enduro car):
http://www.vaughanscott.com/construction.htm#MYCHRON3

I don't have handy any snapshots of data analysis, but you can download the software for free, grab my data, and play with it to your heart's content.

The system I use is the AIM Mychron3 Gold XG Auto. It records speed, RPM, computed gear, lap time, and lateral g's, plus 4 analog inputs your choice. It also has the realtime display (unlike some units, I guess) of rpm (by bar graph and programmable shift lights), previous lap time, 2 analogs, and your choice of battery voltage, rpm (digital #), best lap time, or vehicle speed. Comes with lap beacon and receiver, speed sensor, and two analog sensors.

I've chosen to use my own (stock) sensors; for now I have oil pressure, water temp, longitudinal G's, and yaw rate logged. For engine tuning I'll switch over to from 1 to 4 EGT probes; maybe all 4 on the dyno, just 1 on the track at most.

I agree it's best value, at this level, is for driver training; for this reason I expect to add a steering angle sensor at some point and run that with yaw rate, oil pressure, and either EGT or decel. I don't find the decel and lateral g's that useful except to show a major glaring issue (would be useful for driver comparisons, though). I find yaw rate smoothness is more meaningful, though of course nothing is ever more important than speed.

The best part is to be able to pair it up with the track map and analyze the incremental gains and losses around the track for specific laps by segment. The best tool by far for finding speed.

I can echo GregA's comments about finding speed. The most telling for me was that over 2 consecutive weekends on my home track (where I've been racing for 5 years), I was able to rip well over 3 seconds off my best previous ever laptimes after I started using the data system - this where I'd already pretty much plateaued. Not quite as earth-shattering as having someone else get in and drive, but still amazing to me.

Considering the cost required to get similar amount of time out of, say, the motor, tires, or suspension (if they were even allowed), the data systems suddenly become VERY affordable!!! http://Forum.ImprovedTouring.com/it/smile.gif Less than a grand for multiple seconds? Portable between cars? More durable than NOS? http://Forum.ImprovedTouring.com/it/wink.gif

Plus, it's really fun to be able to say, without guessing or exaggeration, just how fast you were going!

Oh, yeah - wheel speed sensors, just the one on the rear axle for vehicle speed. You wouldn't know what to do with the rest, unless you're trying to perfect your threshold braking. I would also stay away from the linear potentiometers for suspension tuning, unless you have high-end shocks (like the ones we can't run), to tune them. For driver development, you need to know what the driver and car are doing. For the former, the most useful is steering angle; brake and throttle less so. For the latter, lateral and long. g's are a start, yaw rate will really get you there.

Since you're gonna ask (yaw rate is not readily available for these systems) - we're using a production yaw rate sensor from a car equipped with ESP (stability control) - specifically a 2000 Olds Intrigue. You give it power and ground, and it spits out a yaw rate signal and linear accelerometer (long. or lateral, depending on how you mount it). If you really wanted to be a jerque, you could get a couple and use them to try to look at pitch rate and roll rate, along with acceleration in all 3 directions. But that would be the less useful info. As I believe it may have been Carrol Smith once said, "Nothing good has ever been written about the rotation of a car about its pitch or roll axes."

http://Forum.ImprovedTouring.com/it/biggrin.gif


------------------
Vaughan Scott
Detroit Region #280052
'79 924 #77 ITA/GTS1
www.vaughanscott.com

Greg Amy
10-26-2004, 10:02 AM
<font face=\"Verdana, Arial\" size=\"2\">Do...these products overlay data onto the driving video?</font>

Gregg, there is a video function within the software, but I did not explore it. I'd suggest contacting Action Digital for more info:

http://www.actdigital.com

(I also note that they are a banner sponsor of IT.com...)


<font face=\"Verdana, Arial\" size=\"2\">...see what it does with RPM's and the like.</font>

That's the even more encouraging part. I'm this excited about data acq and all we used was the built-in sensors! We did not take advantage of any of the analog inputs available, all we used was the internal 2-axis accelerometer and the GPS input. Couple in the tach, wheel speed, throttle position, brake sensor, and a host of other variables and there's some significant time left in the car.

To give you an example, I compared my best day and best night laps. I saw EXACTLY where I was being a wuss at night and where I could have improved my night times (had I another night stint). What's really interesting is that on both laps I *nailed* the Oak Tree turn exactly the same, but was 4 (?) mph slower at the same braking point going into Roller Coaster. The difference? The killer headlight setup! Thus, the additional aero drag of the lights cost us exactly 4 mph and 1 second (!) per lap. How else are you gonna get that kind of detailed information without speculation?

GregA

lateapex911
10-26-2004, 08:11 PM
I just ordered an AIM MyChron MXL unit.

If you are building a car, you'd be a fool not to do DAQ.

Here's why: (I needed these things tto) You need a good tach. With memory and shift lights, you're looking at over $300 in some cases. A lap timing system is $300 as well. Add shipping, and you are close to $700.

The smaller display AIM unit has a tach with shift lights, and a lap timer on it. PLUS it does a milion other things.

I ordered the MXL unit, which has a bigger display and does a zillion other things for a little more. I was making a cold air inlet, and ws concerned that I might end up with not enough flow at speed. How can I know for sure? Um...simply...a sensor from NAPA, and this trick box and I should know for sure! I can even set an alarm light to indicate that its;gone negative! How cool these things are.

And as the guys pointed out, I expect that it will be able to help me find a litle (or maybe a lot of!?!) speed, and thats a good deal at nearly any price!



------------------
Jake Gulick
CarriageHouse Motorsports
ITA 57 RX-7
New England Region
[email protected]

racer14itc
10-26-2004, 09:46 PM
Originally posted by GregAmy:
I just got my first shot at using data acq, this weekend during the 13-hour race.

Evan Webb brought an Action Digital DL1 with him to install in Kirk's Golf III. We used it during the test day, the qualifying and practice, and all through the 13-hour race. We were able to overlay the stints of the drivers and discuss where we were each strong, and see where we were each weak, and make suggestions to each other for improvements. The bottom line is that we all dropped our lap times about *10 seconds* during the test day alone using this information. I managed to lop off *another* 3-4 seconds during qualifying and the race.

I'll have more to say about this tool later, but this has got to be the best learning tool I have *ever* used in my many years of racing. As I told the guys, I feel like I've been given a new religion, been reborn into the Church of DL1 Data Acquisition. I feel like I have to go out and spread the good news to all you electronics-fearing heathens...

Like I said, we'll have more to share later, but this is Real Good Stuff.

GregA



I'll echo the sentiment about the DL1 data logger. I used the DL1 at Mid-Ohio during the Runoffs and saw dramatic improvements during the week, as well as where I could continue to improve. By using the "lap segment" tool you can see what your theoretical 'best lap' would be if you just DID WHAT YOU ARE ALREADY capable of doing in the car, let alone if you tweak the car. In my case, there's still over 1.5 seconds left at Mid Ohio if I can just drive each segment to my (shown) ability. Saves me $$$ because I don't have to bother with spending $$$ on the car until I extract the maximum from it, and the DL1 shows that.

The cool thing about it is that it is portable (takes about 15 minutes to install the whole shooting match) and very simple to operate. If you have a laptop at the track, downloading the data takes only seconds and within just a couple of minutes you can be viewing track maps, speed vs. distance overlays (for comparing multiple laps of yours and other drivers' laps), etc. The most interesting graphs for me were the lateral g's vs. distance overlays. Showed me where I was using the full capabilities of the car in the corners and where I was wimping out. It also shows if you are early apexing or late apexing corners if you know what you are looking at!

The data logger is practically fool proof and the software interface is very user friendly. Best bang for your buck in racing, IMHO.

MC


------------------
Mark Coffin
#14 GP BSI Racing/Airborn Coatings/The Shop VW
Scirocco
Zephyr Race Coaching and Consulting
http://pages.prodigy.net/Scirocco14gp

[This message has been edited by racer14itc (edited October 26, 2004).]

David Ferguson
10-26-2004, 10:00 PM
Sorry, I haven't kept up with the postings in this topic. Specifically I was asked:


<font face=\"Verdana, Arial\" size=\"2\">David: since you seem to sell all different systems, which do you think is the best bang for the buck and why? Also, of all the sensors and tricks that these systems can do, what is probably the most helpful? I know the accelerometers will give the g's and that will help explain a lot, but what about things like the wheel speed sensors, linear displacement sensors for suspension tuning, etc? Or, is it just better to stick to the basics and not get too deep into it? </font>

I think you can see from the postings above that the AIM (and the Action Digital) system both can deliver great value in the ability to do driver development. The low cost is obviously the first draw, but the software with the AIM system is pretty amazing (has features not found in some $5000+ systems), and it's updated free via the web. Of course, the software is one of the most critical components of any data system -- and the solid/professional feel of the Pi, Stack or MoTeC software can certainly contribute to how much you use/gain from the system.

I find the most useful sensor beyond wheelspeed/RPM/LatG is usually the throttle position. Next is a toss up between Steering and Brake Pressure.

The first thing I look at is usually the speed graph (which I always overlay with my fastest lap at that track), then I usually go to the section times report (a feature found on AIM, Pi, Stack, MoTeC), and look at the fastest rolling lap (this is the real measure of performance over the entire lap). On my Sports 2000, I have suspension position sensors, and I will study the front vs. rear roll to identify opportunities to improve the car with shock changes.

Do you need extra sensors? -- it all depends on what questoins you have -- I have lots of questions and have installed a bunch of sensors (latest was 12 IR sensors for real-time tire-temp measurements, I can now dialin the ideal camber for a critical corner on a particular course).

Regarding video: In addition to the CDS video system mentioned, Stack has a couple of products, once similar to the CDS just overlays text data values on the video stream. The other system called "Synchronized Video" is really powerful. You import your video into the computer along with the data, and it will show you the video on the same screen as your graphs. You can scroll through the video, and the data cursor will update, or move the data cursor, and the video will update. Really great for finding out that you were slow entering that corner because you were behind another car! It's a bit pricy, but totally unique in what it can do.

Please feel free to contact Veracity Racing Data, http://veracitydata.com if you need AIM parts/help, or just want to understand what the various systems available can do for you. Ellen is availalble at 408-732-6606, 9-6 most days.

lateapex911
10-26-2004, 10:22 PM
I forgot to mention that AIM is coming out with modules that will atach to their MXL and MyChron systems for both video interface and GPS data.

I am not sure of eithers full capabilities, but the GPS module is said to offer full 3D track mapping.

David seems to have great input here, and I aould also recommend George at Motorsports Exchange. This guy calls you back before you finish your message! It seemed like no matter how many questions I asked he had full detailed answers.

If anyone will be at the ARRCs find me and I will be happy to give them the nickel tour. Look for my cars pic in the "ARRC spotters guide" here on IT.com

Too bad I'm such a newb at this...you won't get your nickels worth!

------------------
Jake Gulick
CarriageHouse Motorsports
ITA 57 RX-7
New England Region
[email protected]

924Guy
10-26-2004, 10:53 PM
I can also echo 110% the recommendation for George, he was truely awesome about getting me gear in time to upgrade for my impending race!

Likewise, as David was saying about the software... I can only speak to the AIM system, as it's all I've used for racing, but it's without question on par with the stuff we use at work to evaluate data from measurement systems (think data acq for development of production vehicle chassis control systems) which cost upwards of $25k.

------------------
Vaughan Scott
Detroit Region #280052
'79 924 #77 ITA/GTS1
www.vaughanscott.com

Al Seim
11-29-2004, 06:38 PM
An update:

First, thanks to Greg Amy and Mark Coffin for their positive words about the DL1 GPS Data System.

Second, I'd like to give an update regarding the DL1 system and software. As David Ferguson correctly states, the software is a very important part of the equation. We now have a new major release (V5) of the DL1 analysis software (works with DL90s too) which has many detail improvements, including automatic "best theoretical lap" calculation. It also offers synchronized video!

The software (and sample data) is available from our website www.actdigital.com (http://www.actdigital.com). Software, as usual, is free. The video feature does require a separate license after a 30 day trial period.

Feel free to e-mail or call with any questions.

Happy Holidays,

Al Seim
www.actdigital.com (http://www.actdigital.com)

Scott Malbon
12-12-2004, 07:33 PM
The DL1 is on my Christmas wish list and I think Santa will deliver.

Scott

Scott Malbon
12-14-2004, 08:50 PM
Does anyone have DL90 or DL1 files from VIR, CMP, or RR they are willing to share? I need to learn the software and these are the tracks I know best.

Thanks
Scott
[email protected]

BillW
12-16-2004, 10:44 AM
Scott, I have some DL1 data from the 13hr race at VIR here:

http://bw.homeip.net/Bill/DL1/VIR.zip

Bill

ITA Racer
01-15-2005, 08:28 PM
WOW. You guys are good salesmen. I think after reading this post I will be puting a data aqcuisition system on the top of my list. Seems like this will be the bets investment for a new guy. Thanks Dave

Knestis
01-15-2005, 10:00 PM
I got my DL1 a couple weeks ago and am VERY jazzed about it. There's nothing like seeing WHERE one can go faster, rather than just having the grid sheet shouting that you SHOULD.

I look at it like this: Is there any other change that I could make to the car for that money, that is also capable of making my car four seconds a lap faster at VIR?

Nope.

K

Scott Malbon
01-16-2005, 09:28 AM
I'm really looking forward to trying this at the track. BillW was very kind to share his VIR data. (Our lap times are similar.) I've learned a BUNCH about the software working with real data at a track I know. Now, how to use the data to improve lap times - I'll want to see my max lateral Gs, braking, etc through the important corners. Any advice from you guys with DA experience?

Thanks.

Scott

David Ferguson
01-16-2005, 01:14 PM
I have recently been answering some questions about interpreting Speed/RPM/LateralG graphs on this thread:

http://www.apexspeed.com/forums/showthread...63685#post63685 (http://www.apexspeed.com/forums/showthread.php?p=63685#post63685)

Also, we have a data acquisition forum, and many of the older posts have a lot of good info in them. Check out:

http://p081.ezboard.com/fs2racingfrm4

Shortcutsleeping
01-27-2005, 05:01 PM
David Furgeson,

What system exactly did you use to hook up the 12 IR tire temp sensors? That is the exact application I am looking into DA for.

Thanks,

Costas

Spinnetti
03-07-2005, 09:47 AM
Originally posted by gsbaker:
Quick question: Do any, some, or all of these products overlay data onto the driving video?
Gregg

There is a system called 'DAVID' (AIM I think) which is really cool with graphical output, but goodly $ to buy. There is another that just uses text overlay

I thought of this idea 10yrs ago, and built my own with text overlay, dual axis gee, etc.. I was going to offer one commercially (for ~$1k including recorder), but with 2 small kids and now that bigger businesses are kicking in, I dropped the idea.

This is my favorite kind of logging.. not just numeric analysis, but you watch all the other factors that led to the data you got.

David Ferguson
03-07-2005, 09:41 PM
Costas -- sorry I never noticed the update to this topic got a new posting.

My IR temp sensors are connected to a Motec M816 expansion box. This communicates over the CANbus to the main ADL logger. The IR temp sensors are 0-5 volt sensors that are powered by 5 volt. We can adapt them to practically any system that can support a 5V input. The sensors are relatively low cost (the retail price is about $150 each), but we can work on a discount for 12 of them http://ITForum.ImprovedTouring.com/smile.gif

Shortcutsleeping
03-07-2005, 09:50 PM
David,
Thanks for the info. We may indeed be doing some adapting. Ellen has my numbers and I am waiting for a DL1. I'm not sure if I can swing that outlay just yet, but I will as soon as I can. Thanks for all your (and Ellen's) help.

Costas
213487

RonInSD
04-14-2005, 12:17 PM
Has anyone heard any information about the GPS system from RackPak.

http://www.g2extreme.com/

I looks like it has a lot of the same features as the DL1 and it includes a dash. I also thing you can expand the unit via the CAN-Bus port and use RackPaks V-Net sensors.

Here is a response to a e-mail to sent for more information.

Ron,

The expected ship date is around the last of April, first of May. At this time,
we do have a three auxiliary inputs. However, we have not determined exactly
how those will be packaged. We will have the EFI can interface, with those
aftermarket EFI units that we currently read.

If you would like, feel free to give me a call and we can discuss this
in
much more
detail than what I can pass on, through this email.

Thanks for emailing,

Regards,

Tim Anderson
Racepak Data Systems
949-709-5555


[This message has been edited by RonInSD (edited April 14, 2005).]

Ron Earp
04-26-2005, 07:05 AM
Quick and dirty question - it appears the DL-1 is one of the best as far as being self-contained, portable, and not requiring external sensors. True or false?

I'm still doing research and I hope to have a systems before CMP May 31st.


------------------
Ron Earp
NC Region
Ford Lightning
RF GT40 Replica
Jensen-Healey ITS
1/2 a 260Z ITS

racer14itc
04-26-2005, 08:39 AM
Originally posted by rlearp:
Quick and dirty question - it appears the DL-1 is one of the best as far as being self-contained, portable, and not requiring external sensors. True or false?

I'm still doing research and I hope to have a systems before CMP May 31st.



True. I use the DL1, and for the $$$ and ease of use it's an amazingly powerful data acquisition and driving training tool.

Ron, if you have any specific questions about the DL1's capabilities from a user's perspective, e-mail me and I'll give you my phone number. I don't sell DL1's, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night! http://ITForum.ImprovedTouring.com/biggrin.gif

scirocco14gp AT bellsouth DOT net


------------------
Mark Coffin
#14 GP BSI Racing/Action Digital/Airborn Coatings/Krispy Kreme VW Scirocco
http://pages.prodigy.net/Scirocco14gp

Knestis
04-26-2005, 08:41 PM
Come find me at VIR next week and I'll show you whatever you want to see with the DL-1.

K

Ron Earp
04-27-2005, 07:01 AM
Kirk, will do, I want to see some data from a track I know, that would help. I downloaded the software and test track, looks pretty decent, but looked like it'd take some time to set up the display to show the things one is interested in seeing. The price of any of these DA units is not cheap, but I can see where the benefits could easily outweigh the costs over a few events.

------------------
Ron Earp
NC Region
Ford Lightning
RF GT40 Replica
Jensen-Healey ITS
1/2 a 260Z ITS

racer14itc
04-27-2005, 08:59 AM
The DL1 software (and others as well) will print out all sorts of pretty graphs, charts and plots. It's amazing the combinations of variables you can plot. You can literally get too MUCH information!

It's knowing what you're looking at and looking FOR that matters. And that is what takes time to learn, or an experienced data scrubber to help you with. If this person is also an engineer and a driver, understands chassis dynamics and the driver's mindset, you can improve the learning process and communication process tenfold.

The hardware and software is just the beginning of the puzzle! Giving someone a stethoscope, a scalpel, sutures and an ICD-9 book does not a doctor make!

MC

------------------
Mark Coffin
#14 GP BSI Racing/Action Digital/Airborn Coatings/Krispy Kreme VW Scirocco



[This message has been edited by racer14itc (edited April 27, 2005).]

Al Seim
05-05-2005, 11:41 AM
Ron:

I had hoped to be at VIR this weekend myself, but work got in the way so I can't make it. http://ITForum.ImprovedTouring.com/frown.gif

But as Kirk can show you, usable information is only a few clicks away once you've got the data loaded.

The initial blank window is a bit intimidating I'll agree, so I guess that means we ought to post a quick start guide on the website along with the link to the demo software!

Any other questions please feel free to call, we're just up the road from you in Richmond.

Al Seim
Action Digital Race Data Systems
www.actdigital.com (http://www.actdigital.com)
804 358-7289

Ron Earp
05-15-2005, 08:20 PM
There is one I just saw advertised in Grassroots that has a in-car real-time lap timer as well as the GPS datalogging system. $1000 complete. Anyone know anything about this one? I've got to check the magazine again to get the name.

Ron

MadFrog
06-17-2005, 10:49 AM
Does anyone have any experience with the xtremex3 product?
www.xtremex3.com (http://www.xtremex3.com)

they seem to have GPS, and integrated video for close to 3k with one camera. Seems kind of pricey but then again, that includes the video overlay.

Ron Earp
06-17-2005, 10:59 AM
Traqmate - anyone know about this one?

Ron

------------------
Ron Earp
NC Region
Ford Lightning
RF GT40 Replica
White Jensen-Healey ITS
Silver "Skull" 260Z ITS
Email: "rlearp at gt40s.com"

jlucas
06-24-2005, 09:11 PM
Originally posted by rlearp:
Traqmate - anyone know about this one?
Ron

I&#39;ve been looking at the DL1, G2X and TraqMate. The TraqMate display is nice but the software is lacking to the other 2. Finally I think I&#39;m going to go with the DL1 because I place I higher priority on the extra inputs over the in car display as a starting point, later I may add the DASH1. Non GPS systems are not an option for me because the system needs to easily move between cars, also under $1000 was another criteria and you can&#39;t get into an AIM system with GPS for that.

edit: also TraqMate has no functional inputs yet. It&#39;s in the hardware but the software does not support it and they dont&#39; expect to have it for at least a year.

If you want GPS, <1000 and a display get the G2X, but if you value the inputs (G2X only has 2) over the display get the DL1. The DL1 software is slightly easier to use too. You can always add a display to the DL1, you&#39;ll always be stuck with 2 inputs on the G2X. Both use CF cards(up to 2GB!!).

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Jeremy Lucas
Fast Tech Limited

jlucas
07-07-2005, 12:50 PM
Just an update. I've learned some additional information about the G2X unit and I have a G2X unit in hand for testing next week.

Additional info from Racepak:
"Our G2X utilizes our Vnet canbus technology, so in reality you can add many
sensors to the system..utilizing a single cable
to route the data back to the G2X. Our Vnet technology allows the user to simply install our sensors, connect the sensor to the Vnet module, connect all the modules together in a daisy chain arrangement, then route a single cable from the modules back to the G2X. This allows us to create "smart sensors" that know their scaling and calibration values. The user simply instructs the G2X to "read" via the DatalinkII software...all new sensors are automatically added to the software, with appropriate channel name, calibration values, scaling values, logging rates etc.. automatically added.

While it appears we only have two available inputs, one is just an auxiliary wheel rpm input, while the other is the EFI interface...In all reality, the G2X is a full blown data logger. We just wanted to take our time going into this market, before rolling out all the bells and whistles.

The Vnet is something we created a few years back, which allows customers to easily add sensors, without the necessity of hiring an engineer to route a wire for each sensor, pick the type of sensor, calibrate the sensor, scale the sensor, etc. We just have not really highlight this aspect of the G2X, as we wanted our users to first become familiar with how to use the system, before adding additional items."

Ron Earp
07-07-2005, 03:02 PM
I want a display, GPS, and under $1000 - sensor input doesn't matter much to me but that is handled in either of the ones here. What on the Traqmate software was not good, mind you I've not seen much of either.

Ron

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Ron Earp
NC Region
Ford Lightning
RF GT40 Replica
White Jensen-Healey ITS
Silver "Skull" 260Z ITS
Email: "rlearp at gt40s.com"

jlucas
07-07-2005, 03:36 PM
Easiest way to understand the differences is to download the demo for TM & the DL1 and you&#39;ll understand. I dont&#39; believe the G2X demo is available for download but they will send a CD if you call an ask.

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Jeremy Lucas
Fast Tech Limited

924Guy
07-09-2005, 08:12 AM
On the topic, cross-posted from rennlist (may only be useful to those with AIM systems):

Precision AutoResearch Offers AiM Sports Automotive Racing Data Acquisition Seminar

David Redszus, Ph.D., of Precision AutoResearch will present an instructional session on AiM Sports automotive racing data acquisition systems Wednesday, July 13, 2005 in Chicago, IL. As Module I of the "Essence of Performance" series of seminars, the seminar will focus on fundamental concepts and core ideas of data acquisition, analysis, and application to improve automotive racing performance.

Topics will include:

*Overview of data system components and features
*In car installation considerations
*Establishing / customizing your configurations for your application
*Organizing your data for easy retrieval and analysis
*Obtaining downloads and drawing track maps
*Basic data review and analysis
*Review of the unique functions of Race Studio 2 software

Participants are urged to bring their laptops, racing logs, data files, and questions as David and other race engineering consultants will be available after the session to discuss specific situations. Cost for the seminar is $60, pre-registration is required. For more information and registration details, see this webpage: http://www.aimsports.com/support/seminars.html

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Vaughan Scott
Detroit Region #280052
'79 924 #77 ITB/GTS1
www.vaughanscott.com

Scott Malbon
07-10-2005, 07:09 AM
The Redszus seminar seems tailored for the AIM system. Would someone with DL1 learn much?

Scott

924Guy
07-11-2005, 08:03 AM
Yes, it does - couldn't help you with that, you may wish to email them and ask...

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Vaughan Scott
Detroit Region #280052
'79 924 #77 ITB/GTS1
www.vaughanscott.com