Gaining weight

[Andy Bettencourt]

Let's say hypothetically, that YOUR car's minimum weight was raised by 100-150 pounds.

What would you do to make weight?

Add gas?
Add cage?
Put some interior back in?
Add it all in legal ballast?
All or combo of the above?

It seems simple to me but I wanted some creative minds out there to provide feedback...

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Andy Bettencourt
New England Region, R188967
www.flatout-motorsports.com (http://www.flatout-motorsports.com)

[Joe Harlan]

For that much weight you could get a girl friend.... http://ITForum.ImprovedTouring.com/smile.gif

Or I would add ballast and tubing..and a cool suit.

[Banzai240]

I'd still have to find about 25lbs to lose... http://ITForum.ImprovedTouring.com/mad.gif

I'd definately do some cage improvements. Could also use the money I'd save on NOT having to buy a Carbon/Kevlar seat and other high dollar ultralight pieces to pay for GAS!

Definately easier to prepare a car that DOES NOT have to obtain a really low minimum weight...

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Darin E. Jordan
SCCA #273080, OR/NW Regions
Renton, WA
ITS '97 240SX
http://home.comcast.net/~djjordan/Web/DJ_AV1.jpg

[Greg Amy]

Order of priority:

- Maximize stiffness of the cage, especially down low. Make better anti-intrusion bars, better foot protection, etc.
- Add fuel. FWD cars need the rear weight bias. Maybe even add a large fuel cell.
- Add interior pieces to reduce noise and heat, especially down low. Carpet, carpet insulation, sill trim, etc.
- Add ballast.

If I were - hypothetically speaking - dealing with an ITS/SM crossover, I'd probably focus on things easily removable. Fuel, bolt-in cage parts, carpets, and additional ballast.

[itracer]

I would prefer to add ballast over anything else. Fuel is expendable, while it would be fine to add fuel for most sprint races, the car should be able to roll over the scales and make minimums dry. It cars do run enduros, etc. Additional cage would cost more to those that cannot weld. I might also put the spare tire back in or something to that effect.

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Jason
ITB 17 (NER SCCA)
VW Scirocco

[Geo]

Eat more doughnuts? http://ITForum.ImprovedTouring.com/wink.gif


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George Roffe
Houston, TX
84 944 ITS car under construction
92 ITS Sentra SE-R occasionally borrowed
http://www.nissport.com

[oanglade]

Optimize the cage for stiffness.
Depending on where I would like the weight to balance the car, I would look at what I could legally replace/add/change.

For example, a heavier exhaust puts the weight really low.
Sturdier hardware for mounting the seat.
A heavier battery for that light right rear corner.
Ballast.
Gas.
Heavier gauge bulkhead for dividing the driver's compartment from fuel hose.
Sound/heat insulation like carpet, etc




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Ony Anglade
ITA Miata
Sugar Hill, GA

[racer-025]

I would definitly add cage....I'm not hung up on trying to make my car as fast as possible. Safety is my first priority.

[joeg]

Stainless exhaust (full length)--nice and heavy and DOWN LOW in the middle of the car.

Cheaper solution--Put your spare tire and passenger seat back in.

[Russ Myers]

I like Pizza myself.

Russ

[MMiskoe]

Breath a huge sigh of relief to know that the car is finally able to make the minimum. The cry when I think of what that does to the tires.

Then ballast & quit agonizing over how to build things from plastic & aluminum. Ballast is the easist thing to tune to match driver/fuel/tire weights that can change.

[gran racing]

This brings up another question I've been thinking about. During the offseason I've been having some fun with the car (or not with the oil leak amoung other things!!) Within the next few weeks I'll be taking it to the scales.

How close do you get it to the minimum weight? I will be using gas as a ballast and am being on the conservative side with my ending fuel amount. What other very cheap and legal ways are there to add weight where we want it to other than ones already listed here?

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Dave Gran
NER ITB #13
'87 Honda Prelude si

[Banzai240]

Originally posted by gran racing:
What other very cheap and legal ways are there to add weight where we want it to other than ones already listed here?



Once the car is race-ready, safe, and basically "done"... I don't see why you wouldn't just take advantage of the ballasting rules to get it to weight... I believe the 100lbs minimum has been officially removed, unless my timing is off and it hasn't been announced yet...



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Darin E. Jordan
SCCA #273080, OR/NW Regions
Renton, WA
ITS '97 240SX
http://home.comcast.net/~djjordan/Web/DJ_AV1.jpg

[x-ring]

>I don't see why you wouldn't just take advantage of the ballasting rules...

Because by getting creative with allowable items you can improve your weight distribution. As an example, I did an annual inspection on a Miata last weekend where the cage builder used 3/4" steel sheet for the mounting plates on the two right rear mounting points. Very clever, I thought.



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Ty Till
#16 ITS
Rocky Mountain Division

[Banzai240]

Originally posted by x-ring:
Very clever, I thought.


Indeed!

[whenry]

Various safety items: 1)Reinforce battery and fire extinguisher mounts(use metal plate rather than washer). 2)Add bars to cage(1.5# per ft for .095) 3)Add driver aids(cool suit or helmet blower) 4)suspension reinforcements(sway bar mount or tie bars) You do note that most of these items can be mounted fairly low in the car. I forget where I got the ideas.

[gran racing]

Darin, the biggest problem I have with the prelude is how nose heavy it is. I have some weight to play around with and would like a bit more in the rear. Or when you get within 50lbs is it not too important?

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Dave Gran
NER ITB #13
'87 Honda Prelude si

[Bryan Watts]

Add bars to the cage, add other allowable items (cool suit, fire system, etc.), add back interior. Place them in areas that allow you to improve the weight distribution and lower the CG. If you've got ot add weight, you might as well get some benefit from it instead of just bolting 150 pounds to the passenfer floorboard.

[Daryl DeArman]

A combination of driver aids and ballast.

I will be faster and more consistant the more comfortable I am.

As long as the weight distribution is close, I'd be more concerned with polar momment. A long polar momment (like hanging weight outside of the wheelbase) makes the car much slower to change direction. While, you can tune for an unfavorable weight ditrubtion by controlling how fast the weight transfers to the desired end, within reason.

Fuel would be my last choice because it moves the opposite direction you want it to, unless you have some elaborate fuel cell with all kinds of trap doors and baffles.

[gran racing]

Good points Daryl. What about fuel versus ballast on the passenger side footwell? Again, for a front heavy car. Maybe I'll just split the difference.

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Dave Gran
NER ITB #13
'87 Honda Prelude si

[Chuck Davis]

Originally posted by Andy Bettencourt:
Let's say hypothetically, that YOUR car's minimum weight was raised by 100-150 pounds.

What would you do to make weight?

Add gas?
Add cage?
Put some interior back in?
Add it all in legal ballast?
All or combo of the above?

It seems simple to me but I wanted some creative minds out there to provide feedback...

I'm on a campagin to loose at least half the bars of weight out of my car. Doesn't seem to be working. However, the answer to your question is........ ballast!

Chuck Davis

[joeg]

A few of those new Burger King "Enormous Breakfast" sandwiches will work too.

[Ron]

Not that anyone would do this, but, if the weight was removable you could take it out for qualifing and put it in for the race. I have never seen a car have to roll across the scales until after the race.We will never have this option for we are still way over weight. Yes it is cheating, but I know it is done.

[JIgou]

I've had to roll across the scales after qualifying per the Stewards' orders.

Then again, I'm part of the problem, driving a Spec Miata and all... http://ITForum.ImprovedTouring.com/wink.gif

Don't recall if the IT cars in the group with us had to weigh or not.

Jarrod

[zracre]

I must agree with goeg...It seems that many IT drivers seem to think louder is better...then they have puzzled looks on their faces when dqed after the race (happened to me in ITB) when they can make the same amount of power with a nice stainless muffler...and more if they tune it properly. My 92 integra seems to be easy to make weight...i was shocked to find my car light at its opening race at sebring. I have a full length exhaust with the muffler at the rear. Good luck!!

Evan Darling
ITA 1992 Integra

[jcmotorsports]

i had a surprise at vir when i came in 7 pounds heavy with alot more fuel than i calculated to make weight. looks like the spare tire is going back in. add more cage bars, fuel, and spare tire etc, you can place the weight to better balance the car.
john costello
its rx7 #87

[shwah]

When I did my first event we ran the car over the scales and found it to be 100lbs light.

Reinstalled the passenger seat, installed a spare tire and filled the tank to the very tippy top. Rolled across after the race at 12# over.

We are doing a new cage now, but may end up losing weight after pulling out the Autopower erw cage. I plan to reinstall insulation and carpet before the next event and install legal ballast to make up the remainder.

Chris

[This message has been edited by shwah (edited March 30, 2005).]

[SilverHorseRacing]

If you added 150lbs to everyone, I'd breath a sigh of relief. Finally my car could come off track with 1/4 tank of gas and be around minimum weight, rather than 175lbs over.

I kid you not, at the scales at Roebling last year, the tech guy looked at me with a straight face and asked,"what do you have in the trunk of that thing?"

Being Italian, I couldn't resist..."If I tell you WHO I have back there, you'll be joining them!"

http://ITForum.ImprovedTouring.com/smile.gif


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-Marcello Canitano
www.SilverHorseRacing.com (http://www.SilverHorseRacing.com)

[Ron]

Tell it all Marcello, tell it all. You and I are in the same boat (or car). I wish we had to add weight.

Ron

[dyoungre]

The only problem with using fuel as ballast is that it is not tied down. Neither a full tank, nor a near empty tank is much of a problem - but at 1/2 a tank, the 'swish' of the fuel from one side to the other can make left-right transitions a little hairy.

[SilverHorseRacing]

Originally posted by Ron:
Tell it all Marcello, tell it all. You and I are in the same boat (or car). I wish we had to add weight.

Ron

Well if I didn't build a A/S spec cage that I feel safe in, and instead just had a bolt-in six point with the absolute minimum bars in it, I'd be a lot closer to minimum weight. My old car was only like 60lbs. over, and a lighter driver (160 range) would have put it at weight. But again, that's a dangerous precedent to set...make weight or have a safe cage. I'll take the cage and deal with the weight, win or lose, knowing that if I ever have another bounce like I did with the old car, that I should be able to walk away without a scratch. (Not that I didn't last time, but that was just luck of where the impacts occurred.)

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-Marcello Canitano
www.SilverHorseRacing.com (http://www.SilverHorseRacing.com)

[Mark LaBarre]

I have to run the passenger seat, spare tire, #100 ballast ( + 10# mount), extra tubes everywhere plus at least a quarter tank fuel to make minimum.


You could also put in a nice heavy steel fuel cell with wicked "extra safe" mounting.

[x-ring]

Originally posted by Mark LaBarre:
I have to run the passenger seat, spare tire...

What kind of car is it? http://ITForum.ImprovedTouring.com/eek.gif

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Ty Till
#16 ITS
Rocky Mountain Division