LRP pricing themselves into oblivion?

[Jake]

The Jeff Poor memorial had the lowest turn out in years. To put this in perspective, this was the first race of the year, a day after a school, and in a year with only four regionals at LRP (the most convenient track for most at one of the SCCA’s largest regions). What would normally be a huge turn-out, was quite visibly different as soon as you entered the paddock. While usually packed to capacity, with this years paltry turnout there were prime paddock spaces open throughout the day.

The impact was obvious on the track as well. While we are usually asking the head office for permission to run our overfilled ITA/ITC group, we had barely 20 cars last weekend. One of the side effects of this was turning my race into a big yawn. With a full race there are people to play with at every level, but my race turned into a time trial after lap one. I raced right in the middle of the pack, but the pack was so spaced out that I ran most of my laps without even seeing another car.

So now I’m registered for the next race. March 27 is now $280 – nearly double what it was just a few years ago. Plus, they’re charging $20 for spectators at the gate. I don’t think many of my friends are coming to watch me drive around the track by myself for $20/pop. If this keeps up, I’m not sure how long I’ll be racing either. At least it was fun while it lasted.

[This message has been edited by Jake (edited May 15, 2005).]

[gran racing]

As of this morning there are only 133 cars registered (according to the online site) plus how many cars run in the pro SM group. But that's limited to 40 best (worst) case it 173.

$280 is pretty nuts. Oh, but you get two days out of it. ??? Friday seems like a total waste of a day off. For this amount of money we should at least get a true double out of it. I know, the town's agreement. And the track doesn't care much about SCCA and silly club racing. But at some point it will come back to bite them in the butt. I was also pretty shocked at how much a HPDE now costs. Ouch!

How much is a NHIS race - like the one coming up in July typically? What about the Glen?

When is that track in NJ opening up?

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Dave Gran
NER ITB #13
'87 Honda Prelude si

[This message has been edited by gran racing (edited May 15, 2005).]

[Greg Amy]

The Opening Day (one-day) regional at NHIS was $200; the test day was $150. The Jeff Poor Memorial at LRP was $260; the test day was $250.

We've had this discussion many times over the last 6-9 months, but the fact is that LRP controls a limited supply with a high demand. The price reflects that.

The track does not care about car counts, as they get the same track rental fee whether one or one thousand cars enter. The entity that gets hurt is the sanctioning body, in our case NER, MoHud, etc. The only way the track will get "hurt" is if our regions determine that it is no longer economically feasible to hold an event there and chooses not to rent the track. In that case I have no doubt some other group will quickly scoop up the date, therefore, the track loses nothing.

Note, of course, that while it raises the hackles to have the entry fees raised, the actually price difference of $60-80 is a drop in the proverbial budget bucket for racing. In the end, we each have to make our own personal decisions if it's "worth it" to us, and the regions will make their decisions based on the resulting turnout. I sincerely doubt given the almost-total lack of substitutions (competition) that Lime Rock will ever "get hurt" over the price increases... GA

[Jake]

Just to clarify - my main concern is the low turnout. However, I'm not convinced that raising the entry fees increased the money raised since it may be lowering the car count.

Personally, I'm hoping that weather.com's total screwup about calling for rain all day had something to do with the small run groups.

To Dave's point - I for one would be happier to use Friday for two short qualfiying sessions - and have two shorter races on Saturday. But with 10 run groups - that would be tough. However, if the rungroups continue to dwindle, we could probably combine a few more. I think last week we could have run ITA, ITB, and ITC together. Now that would have been a wild race to watch (and be in)!

[Jake]

Was looking at mylaps for the final car counts, here's a way we might be able to cut down a run group:

What ran: total cars/classses
33 ITS, ITB
20 GT1, GT2, GT3, ITE, T1, T2, T3, AS, SPO, CGT1, CGT2, CGT3
25 SM, SSB, SSC
22 SSM
24 ITA, ITC

A suggestion: total cars/classes
34 ITA, ITB
31 ITS, GT1, GT2, GT3, T1, T2, T3, AS, SPO, CGT1, CGT2, CGT3
30 SM, SSB, SSC, ITE
27 SSM, ITC

[Bill Miller]

$280 for a one-day Regional??? And some folks think making IT a National category will drive up entry fees. The Runoffs entry is $300 (up $50 from last year), and they get a couple of practice sessions, three qualifying sessions, and a race.

And guess what, as the car counts continue to dwindle, the entries will keep going up. Because, as someone pointed out, there's a flat fee for the track. They don't care if you only get 10 cars to show up!

LRP is the second-closest track to me, besides Pocono, and I never even look at when the races are at LRP, because I wouldn't bother to go. To me, there's not one thing that makes LRP appealing (I wouldn't spend $180 for a 1-day race)

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MARRS #25 ITB Rabbit GTI (sold) | MARRS #25 HProd Rabbit
SCCA 279608

[Andy Bettencourt]

190 cars pre-registered and I personally know of 5 that stayed home due to the rain factor. We just got plain lucky there.

Threat of HUGE rain at LRP and that entry fee are what kept the people home. If it was going to be gorgeous, I bet about 170 people whould have shown...taking into account the estimated typical 10% no-shows...

AB

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Andy Bettencourt
New England Region, R188967
www.flatout-motorsports.com (http://www.flatout-motorsports.com)

[RSTPerformance]

I think when looking at entry fees you should look at how many people preregister not only the final car counts. If someone preregisters they have at least thought about going. This year 20% less people even concidered going comnpaired to last year. Why??? Well for me I didn't plan on going because there was a race at VIR. I could drive all the way to VIR and get almost 4 times the track time! In the end the actual cost per minute was much much lower including the money to get to the track!! Anyone that argues that the increased entries is a drop in the bucket compaired to total costs needs to think about that..... If that were true then why would you go to LRP to race for 30 min when you can go to VIR and race for 80min? the only cost difference is the gas money to get to the track. And you'll save money because the entry was 10% cheaper than LRP! The majority of the people in Regional racing are on limited budgets and $50.00 more is more than just $50.00 more... That's diner for me for the week!

In my opinion we as a region should not race at LRP in the future. Without SCCA racing at LRP they will go out of business simple as that. The track is already suffering and soon they will have to beg for pro races to race there. WE are in control and we don't even realize it! HPD events will take some of our dates at first but a few years from now when all they have are 1 pro race and then HPD events they will realize they made a terrible mistake. It's time ot put our foot down.

Stephen

Preregistration data:

Car counts down almost 20%!! 187 Vs. 227 last year.
Last year entry fee = $220 * 227 entries = $49,940
This year entry fee = $260 * 187 entries = $48,620

I would conclude that the higher $ for entries is not making up for the higher track rates. I hope someone is showing this to LRP so we can lower the fees in the future! I liked racing at LRP.

Interesting to note that:
SSM gained 2 more entries and SSM gained 3 more entries over last year. The Class is still growing!
ITA, ITB, FV, EP, FP, GT3 make up for the 20% decline in Entires. Make your own judgments on why but I know for me it's the $260.00 in track time for 30-40 min of track time!


PS: Car counts where up at NHIS.

Stephen

[RR]

Sad that its going this way. Dont blame people for now essentially hating this track and the management. There comes a time when you increase profits, and then just rip people off, Lime Rock with their $8 hamburgers and high track fees has fallen into the later. Think I'll make the trek down to VIR, NHIS, or Glen, where they actally WANT the business.

[theracinglawyer]

Corporate Greed includes Racing.

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BE SAFE GO FAST HAVE FUN
Love "the commander"
Mike Cefalo

[0100]

Yeah I headed down to VIR instead of LRP.

Let's see $500 for 9 sessions on a 4.2 mile insane track vs one day at LRP.

It was a no brainer.