Recent BMW 325 For Sale - Q's on Parts

[Ron Earp]

I’ve a question just so I understand how cars are built and how things work in the ITSC.

There is a BMW 325 for sale that claims it will set track records etc. and is a very rapid car. But, it has some pieces on it that I was wondering about as being legal or not. Some items I was not to sure about:

*Fall-Line Underdrive pulley set – pullies are free next year, right?

*Dinan cold air intake – I think these are okay?

*Gruppe N Motor Mounts – Are these supposed to be stock mounts?

*Stock M3 steering rack – Should this be a stock 325i unit?

*Fall Line Motorsports reinforced rear subframe – Is this a BMW certified repair/part/procedure for 325s?

*M3 Differential Axles and Flanges – Should these be stock 325 units?

I’m just wish to learn about parts interchanges as I was thinking many of these would not be okay for SCCA racing. I’m sure I’m not up on all of this and most of this stuff is fine.

Ron



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Ron Earp
NC Region
Ford Lightning
RF GT40 Replica
White Jensen-Healey ITS
Silver "Skull" 260Z ITS

[buldogge]

Hey Ron...

I saw the ad as well (Here/BMWCCA site/Bimmerforums as well)...

I think there are a few issues for sure...here's answers to your querys:

1) UDP's are 100% legal

2) Dinan intake pulls air from the stock location

3) Good question...are motor mounts "bushings"?

4) M3 rack IS NOT legal

5) The repair is to the unibody at the points at which the subframe attaches NOT THE SUBFRAME ITSELF...the reinforcement of the subframe (front or rear) has been discussed IN LENGTH several times here (not very favorably! http://ITForum.ImprovedTouring.com/wink.gif

6) M3 diff flanges and axles ARE NOT legal (unless you consider the diff "open" and the flanges part of this equation possibly).

There is also mention of reinforcing the shock towers F+R and of use of the M3 undertray???

I think the car has a nice spec but a potential buyer should be aware that they would need to change a few bits to be ITS legal...the seller really should list these items so there isno confusion/problems down the line!



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Mark Andrews
'92 ITS BMW 325is

[Ron Earp]

Nick is the lister, the fellow I got my trailer from, but I don't think he is the owner of the car but instead deals with a lot of clients. I remember the subframe discussion and I don't think, if I recall correctly, anyone ever produced documentation that showed the repair, but I might be mistaken.


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Ron Earp
NC Region
Ford Lightning
RF GT40 Replica
White Jensen-Healey ITS
Silver "Skull" 260Z ITS

[mlytle]

i looked at the car in question last year when it was "sort of" for sale. if someone is interested in it and wants an independant opinion, happy to talk offline. i have a bunch of pictures of it too.

nice car, especially with the new motor. as with most all cars, there are a few issues.

[dspillrat]

Originally posted by mlytle:
if someone is interested in it and wants an independant opinion, happy to talk offline.


...Shoot me an email
[email protected]

Thanks,
David Spillman

[dj10]

If you want to see a legal e36 bmw for sale, go to the bmw site look at the post on for sale. I have a legal e36 and so do 2 of my friends in PA. 1 of which is for sale.

[bimmerpower]

Yeah, I looked closely at this car too before building mine. Like stated above, there are several items that need removed, and would consider a protest if new owner doesnt make it compliant. It is a great deal for the price. the engine alone is 7-8K, so it really is a great price. The car is VERY well prepared, and Fall-Line knows their stuff. I would have bought it had it not been for a cash flow issue. Just needs a little work to make it compliant, and it will do VERY well in ITS.

Also, i am pretty sure the X brace is illegal. i see lots of 325i's with this as well.

good luck.

Wade Powell
95 325i ITS ( debuting June 4th http://ITForum.ImprovedTouring.com/smile.gif )
[email protected]

[This message has been edited by bimmerpower (edited May 20, 2005).]

[dj10]

Like stated above, there are several items that need removed, and I planned on protesting it if it shows up in the midwest running against my legal ITS 325i. It is a great deal for the price. the engine alone is 7-8K, so it really is a great price.

Also, i am pretty sure the X brace is illegal. i see lots of 325i's with this as well.

good luck.

Wade Powell
95 325i ITS ( debuting June 4th http://ITForum.ImprovedTouring.com/smile.gif )
[email protected][/B]

Wade,
I agree with you there are several things not legal on this car. The X- Brace is not one of the items. You can have 1 brace and ONLY 1 Brace in the car and the X Brace was in the E36 325 convertibles. At least that is how I read the CR.
dj

[Ron Earp]

Is the 325 convertible in the GCR? I didn't see it in there and when a roadster is used it is specifically mentioned - i.e. Jensen Healey Roadster, Triumph TR8 mentions convertible allowed in the notes section. So, my reading would be that 325 rag top is not classed and therefore 325 rag top bits cannot be used based on it not being on the spec line.

Now, maybe the brace can be used because you are allowed one brace, but that is a different justification basis.

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Ron Earp
NC Region
Ford Lightning
RF GT40 Replica
White Jensen-Healey ITS
Silver "Skull" 260Z ITS

[This message has been edited by rlearp (edited May 19, 2005).]

[JeffYoung]

Correct. You can only run a convertible if it is listed on the spec line, so the X brace is not legal.

DAVID SPILLMAN, are you going over to the dark side???

[Bryan Watts]

The X-brace doesn't seem to fit the "one front stayrod" rule because it doesn't attach between lower suspension mounting points and it is made up of multiple stayrods that attach in 4 different locations.

[This message has been edited by Bryan Watts (edited May 19, 2005).]

[dj10]

Originally posted by rlearp:
Is the 325 convertible in the GCR? I didn't see it in there and when a roadster is used it is specifically mentioned - i.e. Jensen Healey Roadster, Triumph TR8 mentions convertible allowed in the notes section. So, my reading would be that 325 rag top is not classed and therefore 325 rag top bits cannot be used based on it not being on the spec line.

Now, maybe the brace can be used because you are allowed one brace, but that is a different justification basis.



Doesn't the CR say you can update and back date parts in the same model, hence any E36 325? Just because it is the convertible is not listed to race in the ITCR doesn't mean that model doesn't exist. If the model is available and made by BMW (E36 325) the parts can be updated.
Where is a Comp Board Member when you need one. hehe
dj

[Ron Earp]

I don't think the update backdate rule covers this, but I am new to the whole game. Convertibles, when they are raced, are speced that way on the charts with notes or on a separate line. At least that seems to be the tradition.

The Jensen Healey Roadster is speced, while the Jensen Healey GT (a coupe) is not. Same car, same everything almost, but I assume I cannot pull some nifty bits off of it to put on my Roadster since it isn't speced. If I could find one of the 500 or so coupes I'd love to race one since the aero advantage would be nice, but it'd have to be speced and would appear on a different line.

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Ron Earp
NC Region
Ford Lightning
RF GT40 Replica
White Jensen-Healey ITS
Silver "Skull" 260Z ITS

[dj10]

Originally posted by rlearp:
I don't think the update backdate rule covers this, but I am new to the whole game. Convertibles, when they are raced, are speced that way on the charts with notes or on a separate line. At least that seems to be the tradition.

The Jensen Healey Roadster is speced, while the Jensen Healey GT (a coupe) is not. Same car, same everything almost, but I assume I cannot pull some nifty bits off of it to put on my Roadster since it isn't speced. If I could find one of the 500 or so coupes I'd love to race one since the aero advantage would be nice, but it'd have to be speced and would appear on a different line.


Ron,
What would happened if Jensen Roadster say E50 for sake of argument, and the GT was a E50 also? Would it be covered? If the GT was a E50M then it would be.

[Knestis]

No CB member needed, dj.

"...updating and/or backdating of components is only permitted ithin cars ofthe same make, model, body type (e.g. sedan, station wagon, convertible, etc.), and engine size as listed on a single [ITCS] specification line."

So that's a non-starter. In addition, invoking the "one brace" rule without reading it is dangerous. I'll let you look that one up but suffice to say that anything that is accurately described as an "X-brace" is going to fail.

K

[dj10]

Originally posted by dj10:

Originally posted by rlearp:
I don't think the update backdate rule covers this, but I am new to the whole game. Convertibles, when they are raced, are speced that way on the charts with notes or on a separate line. At least that seems to be the tradition.

The Jensen Healey Roadster is speced, while the Jensen Healey GT (a coupe) is not. Same car, same everything almost, but I assume I cannot pull some nifty bits off of it to put on my Roadster since it isn't speced. If I could find one of the 500 or so coupes I'd love to race one since the aero advantage would be nice, but it'd have to be speced and would appear on a different line.


Ron,
What would happened if Jensen Roadster say E50 for sake of argument, and the GT was a E50 also? Would it be covered? If the GT was a E50M then it would NOT be.

[dj10]

Originally posted by Knestis:
No CB member needed, dj.

"...updating and/or backdating of components is only permitted ithin cars ofthe same make, model, body type (e.g. sedan, station wagon, convertible, etc.), and engine size as listed on a single [ITCS] specification line."

So that's a non-starter. In addition, invoking the "one brace" rule without reading it is dangerous. I'll let you look that one up but suffice to say that anything that is accurately described as an "X-brace" is going to fail.

K

K,
Looks like you are right after reading the the it rules again. Body points are not suspension points.
dj

[JeffYoung]

Correct, but the x brace also fails the update/backdate rule. The GCR specifically says that you can't run the convertible of a car unless (a) it only came as a covertible or (B) it is listed on the spec line, or has its own spec line. I know this because I had to get teh TR8 convertible added to the Spec Line to run mine.

Since the 325i came as both a convertible and a coupe, and since the convertible is not listed, the use of the X brace on the conertible on coupe race cars is not authorized by teh update backdate rule.

[Ron Earp]

Originally posted by dj10:

Ron,
What would happened if Jensen Roadster say E50 for sake of argument, and the GT was a E50 also? Would it be covered? If the GT was a E50M then it would be.



I don't think it would be based on what Kirk has pulled out of the GCR. It has to be the same body type - the convertible is different from the coupe. And, a 325i convertible is different from a 325i sedan. And, that is why convertibles are listed or specifically singled out on the spec lines.

Ron



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Ron Earp
NC Region
Ford Lightning
RF GT40 Replica
White Jensen-Healey ITS
Silver "Skull" 260Z ITS

[ITANorm]

Originally posted by buldogge:
3) Good question...are motor mounts "bushings"?


Sadly, no. I've tried to argue that with the powers-that-be.

I got a written "opinion" from the tech department a couple of years ago on this. That is why I have a pair of urethane-filled motor mounts on the shelf - instead of in the car. Since "engine mount" (aka: motor mount) is a defined term in the glossary, it stands alone and is NOT a bushing.



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Norm - #55 ITA, '86 MR2. [email protected]
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Website: home.alltel.net/jberry (http://home.alltel.net/jberry)