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Banzai240
10-29-2003, 02:20 PM
I would like to gather some information from anyone willing to share.

What I would like each of you to do is to list the following information:

[list] Driver weight
[list]


I'd like to see just how close to the minimum classification weight IT cars are actually able to get.

Here, I'll start:


[list] Driver Weight: 220
[list]


Thanks,


------------------
Darin E. Jordan
SCCA #273080, OR/NW Regions
Auburn, WA
ITS '97 240SX
http://home.comcast.net/~djjordan/Web/240_OR_041203_thumb.jpg

oanglade
10-29-2003, 02:31 PM
Car: 1990 Mazda Miata
Class: ITA
Spec Weight: 2200
Race Weight: 2245
Driver weight: 200

ITSRX7
10-29-2003, 02:35 PM
Car: 2G RX-7
Class: ITS
Spec Weight: 2680
Race Prepped Weight: ~2680
Driver Weight: 200

(Could be as much as 10lbs under - unballasted)

AB

------------------
Andy Bettencourt
06 ITS RX-7
FlatOut Motorsports
New England Region
www.flatout-motorsports.com

ITA_CRX
10-29-2003, 02:37 PM
Car: 1988 Honda Civic CRX Si
Class: ITA
Spec: 2140
Actual: 2165
Fatso, I mean Driver: 215

Greg Amy
10-29-2003, 03:12 PM
Car: 1992 Nissan NX2000
Class: ITS
Spec Weight: 2490
Race Prepped Weight: ~2475, zero fuel. We could probably lose another 20-25 pounds legally (but very expensively, as in 14" Panasports).
Driver Weight: 200


May I be so bold as to ask why you're fishing for this info? PCAs?

x-ring
10-29-2003, 03:17 PM
Car: 1976 Datsun 280Z
Class: ITS
ITCS Weight: 2730 lbs (IIRC)
Actual (impound) weight: 2810 lbs
Driver weight: 240 lbs (Hey, I'm 6'04")

The car will probably loose 20 or more pounds this winter - I have a huge (22 gal) cell for which I've ordered a 12 gal replacement.

Ty

ddewhurst
10-29-2003, 03:31 PM
Car: 1985 Mazda RX-7 ("S" model)
Class: Spec-7
Spec Weight: 2530
Race Prepped Weight: 2535 (2 gal of fuel)
Driver Weight: 190

joeg
10-29-2003, 03:41 PM
Car: 1981 Mercury Lynx
Class: ITC
ITCS Weight: 2100 lbs
Actual weight (w 1/2 tank of gas & w/driver): 2230 lbs
Driver weight: 225 lbs
The car cannot lose much if anything.
I can lose a bit but you would need a jockey to run this car at the minimum!


[/B][/QUOTE]

MarkL
10-29-2003, 04:11 PM
Vehicle Year/Make/Model: 1980 Mercury Bobcat
IT Class: B
Classification Weight: ??
Actual, unballasted race-prepped weight w/ driver: 2613 (as of 1993: not stripped to current limit of IT prep rules.)
Driver weight: 183

Note: I am not currently an active member or racer, but I hold out hope of returning to competition, probably with this car.


[This message has been edited by MarkL (edited October 29, 2003).]

MarkL
10-29-2003, 04:12 PM
http://Forums.ImprovedTouring.com/it/confused.gif http://Forums.ImprovedTouring.com/it/redface.gif

[This message has been edited by MarkL (edited October 29, 2003).]

itafiero
10-29-2003, 04:12 PM
Car: 1988 Pontiac Fiero
Class: ITA
Spec Weight: 2780
Possible Race Weight: 2693
Race Weight: 2780 (passenger seat, 5 gal, and ballast)
Driver Weight: 215 with gear

itaintegra31
10-29-2003, 04:20 PM
Car: 1991 Acura Integra
Class: ITA
Spec weight: 2480
Actual weight: 2510
Driver weight: 145

------------------
Ron Carroll
REC Motorsports Inc.
#35 ITA integra

Banzai240
10-29-2003, 04:27 PM
Originally posted by grega:
May I be so bold as to ask why you're fishing for this info? PCAs?

Yes you may and I'd be happy to tell you...

I'm just trying to look ahead a bit and see what types of changes might be required to the ballast rules, PCAs or no PCAs...

Thanks for the data so far everyone! Please, keep it coming! You wanted to be part of the process, so here is a chance to do provide some useful information... (can you FEEL the power???.... Of the Internet, that is! http://Forums.ImprovedTouring.com/it/wink.gif )



------------------
Darin E. Jordan
SCCA #273080, OR/NW Regions
Auburn, WA
ITS '97 240SX
http://home.comcast.net/~djjordan/Web/240_OR_041203_thumb.jpg

RSTPerformance
10-29-2003, 05:37 PM
Vehicle Year/Make/Model: 1984 Audi Coupe
IT Class: B
Classification Weight: 2490
Actual, unballasted race-prepped weight w/ driver: 2440 (at end of race with some sort of amount of gas, but not much)
Driver weight: 165-195

We have 2 cars, both cars could weigh a lot less then minimum weight requirements with empty tanks and no ballast however to meet the rules we ballast using 50 lb. lead and gas to make the minimum at the end of a race... oh and we have the spare tire in the car, oh and we have not scraped all that undercoating and stuff off, and wait still more, we still have complete dash and side pannels in car, along with power windows, sunroof, etc.

The later year ITB Audi Coupe GT's min class weight is 2540 (50lbs more). all other info would be the same as it is basically the same car with bigger brakes and different bumpers.

The 1987 Audi Coupe GT 2.3L ITA car has min weight of 2540 and all other info would be the same as it is basically the same car as the later year Audi Coupe GT's only with a different motor and rear disk brakes.

Hope this helps;
Raymond Blethen
RST Performance Racing

Scooter
10-29-2003, 05:37 PM
Vehicle Year/Make/Model '89 RX7
IT Class ITS
Classification Weight 2680
Actual, unballasted race-prepped weight w/ driver ~2680 I run without ballast.
Driver weight 195

Bill Miller
10-29-2003, 06:37 PM
Year/Make/Model: 84 VW GTI
Spec weight: 2180#
Race weight w/ driver: 2135# (~1/2 tank of fuel, less the 50# of ballast)
Driver weight: 200#

------------------
MARRS #25 ITB Rabbit GTI (sold) | MARRS #25 HProd Rabbit
SCCA 279608

sgraves
10-29-2003, 06:37 PM
1984 ITS 944
Spec weight 2715
actual weight 2745 with 3 to 4 gals of fuel
driver 175
Could lose more weight since the pass seat and radio are still in.

Kazoo
10-29-2003, 06:46 PM
*Vehicle Year/Make/Model: 1987 Mustang
*IT Class: ITB
*Classification Weight: 2640
*Actual, unballasted race-prepped weight w/ *driver: 2648 w/driver, no ballast, 4 gallons of gas, and wheels that weighed (OUCH!) 23lbs a piece!
*Driver weight: 225
This car did NOT have the undercoating removed.

Tristan Smith
10-29-2003, 06:50 PM
1989 Nissan 240sx
ITA
Minimum weight:2530
Race weight: 2610
Driver Weight: 150

dickita15
10-29-2003, 06:58 PM
82 rx7
ita
2380
2505 w 2 gallons
250
car has some crash repair that adds weight.
i know with a real clean car and a 180 lb driver you an just make it
dick

10-29-2003, 07:59 PM
Vehicle Year/Make/Model..77 AMC PACER 4CYL
IT Class..ITA
Classification Weight..2850
Actual, unballasted race-prepped weight w/ driver..3050
Driver weight..300

TypeSH
10-29-2003, 10:43 PM
'98 Honda Prelude
ITS
Spec 2905
Actual 2850
Driver 180

Fleetcare
10-30-2003, 01:39 AM
Car: 1989 Honda Civic CRX Si
Class: ITA
Spec: 2140
Actual: 2141
Including 45lbs of ballast and a 140lb driver

joeg
10-30-2003, 08:32 AM
We need to introduce all of those male drivers under 180 lbs. to the benefits of McDonald's

Greg Gauper
10-30-2003, 09:27 AM
Car was formerly an IT 1984 Civic HB.
Class: ITC
Spec Weight: 1955lbs
Actual Weight: 1970lbs (with some gas in the tank, don't know exactly how much).

Driver: 160lbs....working to get down to 145 over the winter.

theenico
10-30-2003, 09:46 AM
car: 1983 VW Scirocco
class: ITB
classification weight: 2270
actual weight w/driver: 2110 (not a typo!)
driver weight: 145

------------------
Nico
KCRaceware (816) 257-7305
[email protected]

924Guy
10-30-2003, 09:56 AM
'79 Porsche 924 (couldn't see that coming, could ya? http://Forums.ImprovedTouring.com/it/wink.gif
ITA
2600lb ITCS weight
2500lb potential race weight (now running with ballast and extra cage tubes)
160lb driver weight

------------------
Vaughan Scott
Detroit Region #280052
'79 924 #77 ITA/GTS1
www.vaughanscott.com

10-30-2003, 10:01 AM
Vehicle Year/Make/Model..81 RX7
IT Class..ITA
Classification Weight..2380
Actual, unballasted race-prepped weight w/ driver..2383 w/enough gas to race
Driver weight..200

[This message has been edited by 7'sRracing (edited October 30, 2003).]

dspillrat
10-30-2003, 11:42 AM
240-Z
Spec weight...2430
Weighed....2420
1 gallon fuel,some tar left on underside
Driver..205 and counting down

David Spillman

Karl Bocchieri
10-30-2003, 12:26 PM
2G RX-7
spec 2680
weight 2770
driver 240 lbs

Eagle7
10-30-2003, 01:39 PM
[list] Driver weight: 210
[list]


------------------
Marty Doane
ITS RX7 #13
CenDiv WMR

rbt510
10-30-2003, 08:15 PM
1968 Datsun 510
IT Class = ITC
classification weight = 2170
race weight w/driver = 2240 ,5 gals of fuel,Bolt in cage with nascar bars added
Driver weight = 195

Good luck with the survey.

Bob T.

Banzai240
10-31-2003, 11:28 AM
To everyone who has responded thus far, thank you VERY much! This information is invaluable in the quest to better understand the needs and state of IT.

I could use some more data, so if you haven't taken the time to respond, I urge you to do so. This information is not being compiled with any names attached, so once your car is listed on the spreadsheet, it's just a line after that.

If you'd wish to remain more anonymous, feel free to e-mail me with the info directly at:

[email protected]

Thanks,


------------------
Darin E. Jordan
SCCA #273080, OR/NW Regions
Auburn, WA
ITS '97 240SX
http://home.comcast.net/~djjordan/Web/240_OR_041203_thumb.jpg

Jake
10-31-2003, 09:21 PM
I'll Play!

[list] Driver Weight: 200
[list]

I could probably shed another 25lbs with Panasports, a header, and Hoosiers. Also the 87-89 MR2's are a bit heavier than the 85-86 cars that most people run.

Bill Miller
11-01-2003, 07:50 AM
Interesting analysis of the driver weight data.

Sample size: 29
Mean: 200.1#
Meadian: 200#
Mode: 200#
StdDev: 33.3#

I know this a small sample size, but isn't the 'typical' driver weight that is used 180#?

------------------
MARRS #25 ITB Rabbit GTI (sold) | MARRS #25 HProd Rabbit
SCCA 279608

lateapex911
11-01-2003, 01:04 PM
More proof that we need new younger blood in the SCCA roadrace game!

We're all old, out of shape, and fat!

(Me too, I could lose a few. But getting down to 180 might be tough....I'm 6'3, around 200)

------------------
Jake Gulick
CarriageHouse Motorsports
ITA 57 RX-7
New England Region
[email protected]

Eagle7
11-01-2003, 04:09 PM
I'm about 195 in the buff, but listed 210 figuring that was about right with gear.

Let's see, 180 minus gear would put me ... in the grave.

------------------
Marty Doane
ITS RX7 #13
CenDiv WMR

Bill Miller
11-01-2003, 06:40 PM
Originally posted by lateapex911:
More proof that we need new younger blood in the SCCA roadrace game!

We're all old, out of shape, and fat!

(Me too, I could lose a few. But getting down to 180 might be tough....I'm 6'3, around 200)



Maybe if you'd stay off those large burgers at the Black Duck, you wouldn't have that problem!!! http://Forums.ImprovedTouring.com/it/eek.gif http://Forums.ImprovedTouring.com/it/biggrin.gif



------------------
MARRS #25 ITB Rabbit GTI (sold) | MARRS #25 HProd Rabbit
SCCA 279608

MMiskoe
11-01-2003, 08:44 PM
ITS Nissan 300zx 1984
GCR Min: 2865#
w/ driver, ballast & 2 gal fuel 2870#
Driver weight - 155#
Ballast - 60#

ITS Nissan 300zx 1987
GCR Min: 2865#
w/ driver, no balast 5 gal fuel 2958#
Driver - 155#
These cars got heavier in '86

MMiskoe
11-01-2003, 08:46 PM
ITS Miata 1995
GCR Min - 2200#
Race weight w/ 2 gal fuel - 2305
driver - 155#

Can't find anywhere that we could ditch 100# out of that car!!!

Banzai240
11-02-2003, 01:17 AM
Originally posted by MMiskoe:
Can't find anywhere that we could ditch 100# out of that car!!!

I have the same problem with mine...

Thanks for the information! Keep it coming guys/gals...



------------------
Darin E. Jordan
SCCA #273080, OR/NW Regions
Auburn, WA
ITS '97 240SX
http://home.comcast.net/~djjordan/Web/240_OR_041203_thumb.jpg

Dave Zaslow
11-02-2003, 08:33 AM
ITB VW Rabbit
Spec 2180#
Race 2180# with 5 gal in tank (post race)
Driver 185#
spare tire on steel wheel installed (+/- 30#)
extra bars in cage (about 15 feet)
basic fire system
undercoating not scraped off
no other extraordinary measures
car could easily be 30-50# lighter
lots of other Rabbit GTI's are running a lot of lead

Don
11-02-2003, 01:20 PM
1974 Honda Civic 1200
Back dated with 1973 bumpers
SCCA ITC spec with driver 1710
Factory manual lists stock weight at 1635
IT trim, Its an econobox nothing in the interior to throw out except the seats and add the roll cage = 1677lbs
Driver weight 160

BVNitta
11-02-2003, 02:20 PM
1974 ITB Opel Manta
GCR #: 2230
Pre-race # (w/driver): 2290
(Gas: 8 gal)
Driver #: 140 (that should drop the avg a bit..)
About 15ft of extra rollcage tubes (30#)
No ballast

Bhima

moto62
11-03-2003, 12:40 AM
ITA
'91 Integra
Spec- 2480
Race- 2580 w/ 1/2 tank of fuel
Driver-200
Car and driver could stand to lose some weight http://Forums.ImprovedTouring.com/it/smile.gif
Ray

Allen Brown
11-03-2003, 08:22 AM
Here's one more...

Car: 1985 RX-7 GSL-SE
Class: ITS
Spec Weight: 2530 lb
Race Weight: 2530 lb. w/no ballast, approx. 3 gal fuel, and NO windshield washer bottle
Driver Weight: 175 lb

Greg Amy
11-03-2003, 10:52 AM
<font face=\"Verdana, Arial\" size=\"2\">Interesting analysis of the driver weight data.</font>

Updated stats:
Sample size: 37
Mean: 192.5#
StdDev: 34.1#

That calculates to a z-score of 2.23. This is greater than 1.96 (normal distribution, greater than 30 sample size, 95% confidence level), indicating that the sample average weight is statistically greater than the accepted population average of 180#...

We're, on average, a bunch of lard butts.

Banzai240
11-03-2003, 11:17 AM
Originally posted by grega:
We're, on average, a bunch of lard butts.

You guys crack me up! http://Forums.ImprovedTouring.com/it/wink.gif

Here, since you seem to have nothing but "Statistical" time on your hands... here is a link to the data I've collected thus far (Minus the last post for the GSL-SE RX-7)...

I'll update this as new data arrives. I've calculated the required ballast for both a 180lb and a 220lb driver to give a range of ballast weight that would be required. As you can see, very few cars are pushing the current 100lb limit, though I suspect there are some that are "better developed" (meaning, they've bent the rules every way possible to try to remove weight...) that may be getting close...

If you come up with any interesting observations, be sure to post them... You may see something that no one else thought of!

Enjoy!

IT Ballast Spreadsheet (http://home.comcast.net/~djjordan/Web/SCCA/IT_Min_Weights.xls)

------------------
Darin E. Jordan
SCCA #273080, OR/NW Regions
Auburn, WA
ITS '97 240SX
http://home.comcast.net/~djjordan/Web/240_OR_041203_thumb.jpg

[This message has been edited by Banzai240 (edited November 03, 2003).]

planet6racing
11-03-2003, 12:05 PM
Vehicle: 1992 Saturn SL2
Class: ITA
Classification weight: 2360
Actual weight: 2520
Driver Weight: 195

Note: this was before my current weight reduction project to remove everything the rules allow. In April, when I'm down 20# and the car is stripped to the minimum, I'll re-weigh.


------------------
Bill
Planet 6 Racing
bill (at) planet6racing (dot) com

11-03-2003, 12:10 PM
cant open the file Darin, win xp dosnt reconize the format.

11-03-2003, 12:13 PM
Originally posted by dspillrat:

240-Z
Spec weight...2430
Weighed....2420
1 gallon fuel,some tar left on underside
Driver..205 and counting down

David Spillman


ya right, try this, "I HATE BEER, I HATE BEER ect"

Banzai240
11-03-2003, 12:28 PM
Originally posted by 7'sRracing:
cant open the file Darin, win xp dosnt reconize the format.

OH, sorry, I should have told you what it was...

The file is an Excel Spreadsheet. Try right clicking on the link, then "save target as...", then open it with Excel. If that doesn't work, let me know and I'll see about putting it into a text format and just posting it here...

Thanks




------------------
Darin E. Jordan
SCCA #273080, OR/NW Regions
Auburn, WA
ITS '97 240SX
http://home.comcast.net/~djjordan/Web/240_OR_041203_thumb.jpg

whenry
11-03-2003, 03:20 PM
Most of y'all are in the situation I was in about 2 seasons ago. I went from 222# to 165# when my Dr wouldnt sign off on my SCCA physical due to my blood pressure( the goal # goes down as your age goes up and at age 45, I hit the wall. I decided to try to reduce my bp without medication and my Dr laughed saying that I could not lose enough weight to make a difference. I won! Now it is just a matter of maintenance kinda like the car.

Banzai240
11-03-2003, 03:38 PM
Originally posted by whenry:
Most of y'all are in the situation I was in about 2 seasons ago. I went from 222# to 165# when my Dr wouldnt sign off on my SCCA physical due to my blood pressure....

Wow... that's quite a change in weight. That would definately take care of my minimum weight problem, however, I'd likely not have enough strength to drive the car at that weight...

I'm 6'3", and haven't weighed 165 since about 8th grade! Ideal for me would be about 195 to 200, which is only about 20lbs away...

Good Job on lowering you BP!

DJ

gsbaker
11-03-2003, 03:46 PM
Here goes...

Car: BMW 5-series wagon

IT Class: IT's class is "street"

Spec Weight: Can't find it in the GCR, but the owner's manual says something like 3,650

Race Weight: With the two dogs in the back (they love the station wagon tour), it's good for 3,800. I'm sure I could find another 100# of tools, but they might crowd the dogs.

Driver weight: 200

Ta Da! An even two tons!

Thankfully, the car has a great set of brakes.

------------------
Gregg Baker
Isaac, LLC
[email protected]

oanglade
11-03-2003, 04:54 PM
I went from 350 pounds to about 200 pounds. It was cheaper than buying a new motor and the BP pills money went to the tire budget.

Still can't get the Miata to min. weight...

Bill Miller
11-03-2003, 05:42 PM
As you can see, very few cars are pushing the current 100lb limit, though I suspect there are some that are "better developed" (meaning, they've bent the rules every way possible to try to remove weight...) that may be getting close...


Darin,

My Rabbit GTI used 1.5 x 0.120 tubing instead of the required 0.095. It also had ~20' of extra tubing in it. I still had to run 50# of ballast to just make weight w/ 1/2 a tank of fuel. Mfg's curb weight on the car was 2011#. I figure w/o the larger tubing size, and the extra 20' of tubing, I'd have to run the full 100# of ballast and try and finish w/ close to a full tank of fuel. Oh yeah, I guess I better have a couple more Wendy's Big Bacon Classics! http://Forums.ImprovedTouring.com/it/eek.gif

------------------
MARRS #25 ITB Rabbit GTI (sold) | MARRS #25 HProd Rabbit
SCCA 279608

RSTPerformance
11-03-2003, 06:08 PM
Originally posted by Banzai240:


As you can see, very few cars are pushing the current 100lb limit, though I suspect there are some that are "better developed" (meaning, they've bent the rules every way possible to try to remove weight...) that may be getting close...

If you come up with any interesting observations, be sure to post them... You may see something that no one else thought of!

Enjoy!

IT Ballast Spreadsheet (http://home.comcast.net/~djjordan/Web/SCCA/IT_Min_Weights.xls)




Actually my car runs with 75# of ballast and a full tank of gas.... (18 gallons) this will bring me in about 10# over the limit for an event that runs for about 30min. The only reason I run with more weight is because of the location of the weight.... over the rear wheels as apposed to the front of the car.

What I do not understand is why the exact same car in ITB with bigger brakes has to weight 50# more than the other one. The only reason I don't understand is becasue in the past we did not do competition adjustments when figuring out the weight of any car...... ya sure that's what they say anyway http://Forums.ImprovedTouring.com/it/wink.gif I thaugt about running the bigger brakes however I can barly make min. weight now and would not be able to with the extra 50#'s

Stephen

Bill Miller
11-03-2003, 09:52 PM
Stephen,

It looks like there are some differences in the gear ratios as well.

Also, per what was published in FasTrack, and what I think has been generally accepted as the way they do things, the cars are comp. adjusted when they're classified. Or at least the weights are set based on a collection of factors, one of which is the size of the brakes.

Kind of like the A2 16v Golf in ITA weighs less than the A2 8v Golf in ITB.

------------------
MARRS #25 ITB Rabbit GTI (sold) | MARRS #25 HProd Rabbit
SCCA 279608

dspillrat
11-04-2003, 09:59 AM
Originally posted by 7'sRracing:

ya right, try this, "I HATE BEER, I HATE BEER ect"

Hey!! watchit I resemble that remark.....Food in general is the enemy,I like it all
David

grjones1
11-04-2003, 04:17 PM
[list] Driver weight
[list]

1979 ITC Ford Fiesta
Spec: 1780
Actual with Driver: 1910
Driver: 165-185 After and before 16 laps at Summit. (Actually depends on what time of the year.)
G.Robert Jones

[/B]

Domino
11-07-2003, 06:02 PM
'90 CRX Si
ITA
Spec: 2140
Race weight: 2160
Driver: 152

mlytle
11-07-2003, 06:51 PM
Vehicle: 1988 BMW 325is
Class: ITS
Classification weight: 2750
Actual weight: 2460 (7/8ths tank of gas)
Driver Weight: 195
Ballast Weight: 95

very easy to make these cars light. i have to start a sprint race with a full tank of gas to make min weight in impound.

marshall

Banzai240
11-08-2003, 04:51 AM
Originally posted by mlytle:
Vehicle: 1988 BMW 325is
Class: ITS
Classification weight: 2750
Actual weight: 2460 (7/8ths tank of gas)
Driver Weight: 195
Ballast Weight: 95


Marshall,

Is the 2460 weight WITH driver, or WITHOUT??? I need to know the weight of the car, WITH driver, in normal race trim, MINUS any actual ballast weight...

Thanks,



------------------
Darin E. Jordan
SCCA #273080, OR/NW Regions
Auburn, WA
ITS '97 240SX
http://home.comcast.net/~djjordan/Web/240_OR_041203_thumb.jpg

mlytle
11-09-2003, 11:26 PM
actual is without driver.
note that actual + driver + ballast = classification weight.

when you say "race weight" do you mean at the start or finish? 20+lbs difference for a 30min sprint. i try to finish at 2755 total. so that would be 2660 without ballast.

Banzai240
11-10-2003, 12:13 AM
Originally posted by mlytle:
i try to finish at 2755 total. so that would be 2660 without ballast.

OK, 2660 makes a lot more sense... You had typed 2460 above, which resulted in a 180lb driver needing over 300lbs of ballast! http://Forums.ImprovedTouring.com/it/eek.gif Kind of didn't jive with the 95lbs you noted...

Thanks for responding...

Darin

ITANorm
11-10-2003, 12:29 AM
Vehicle: 1986 Toyota MR2
Class: ITA
Classification weight: 2370
Actual weight: 2375
Driver Weight: 180

I suspect the car could drop another 25 pounds, legally; no more.

Banzai240
11-10-2003, 02:19 PM
I've updated the online version of the spreadsheet containing this data, as well as added some logic to reflect cars that are over/underweight... The negative ballast values, which appear in Red, are those cars that, in whatever prep they are, are over their minimum weight...

Enjoy!

IT Minimum Weights Spreadsheet, Nov. 10, 2003 (http://home.comcast.net/~djjordan/Web/SCCA/IT_Min_Weights.xls)

------------------
Darin E. Jordan
SCCA #273080, OR/NW Regions
Auburn, WA
ITS '97 240SX
http://home.comcast.net/~djjordan/Web/240_OR_041203_thumb.jpg

[This message has been edited by Banzai240 (edited November 10, 2003).]

ITANorm
11-10-2003, 06:27 PM
Just FWIW, I'd like to see the Briggen Brothers' VW's listed. I think they would blow the ITB VW GTI numbers out the door. I do know that when someone else borrowed one of their cars (and he was no lightweight himself), and they forgot to re-ballast, he was underweight by over 100#.

VW16VRacer
11-11-2003, 12:43 AM
Car: 89 16V Golf
Spec weight (ICSCC EP) 2214 w/driver
Actual weight: 2320 w/driver
driver: 190

Jon Bonforte #99
German Performance Systems
Portland Oregon

VW16VRacer
11-11-2003, 12:46 AM
P.S.

Car would run ITA

11-11-2003, 11:40 AM
Originally posted by dspillrat:
Hey!! watchit I resemble that remark.....Food in general is the enemy,I like it all
David


LOL Most of us resemble that remark, F.G.C.A
Fat Guys Club of America
next year there putting in all handycapped portoheads w/handrials to speed up the paddock. now you know why there not classifying any new prod cars, we dont fit in them anyway...... Cobra is coming out with a new seat for club racers, there calling it the "Imola Lardo"... The club was going to bring back the Le Manns running start but they didnt think a picture of 40 guys butts stuck in windows would be good for the cover of "Sports Car"...
Sorry to hijack your thread Darrin, just thought it would be funny to point out that combined we have the curb weight of the Lusitania..



[This message has been edited by 7'sRracing (edited November 11, 2003).]

chuck baader
11-11-2003, 08:19 PM
For those of you that didn't know, Sparco already makes a wide seat, the EVO 2, better known as the "FA" seat..fat azz...I love mine with my 275# frame....

------------------
Chuck Baader
SEDIV ITS #36 E30 BMW
Alabama Region Assistant Race Chair, Divisional Registrar

fiestadude
11-12-2003, 10:39 AM
Car: 1979 Ford Fiesta
Class: ITC
Spec Weight: 1780
Race Weight: 1955
Driver weight: 190



------------------
JJ
#62 ITC

sgraves
11-13-2003, 11:34 AM
I didn't see this one on the spreadsheet. Here it is again.

1984 Porsche 944
Spec weight = 2715lbs
Actual weight = 2745lbs at last race with 4 gallons of fuel.
Driver weight = 175lbs
I could easily get this car below the minimum weight.

geekITSracer
11-28-2003, 12:48 AM
Car: 240Z
Class: ITS
Spec weight: 2430
Weight w/driver & 1/2 tank: 2441
Driver weight: ~130

No ballast, but I haven't stripped it, either, nor sprung for Panasports yet.

philstireservice
11-28-2003, 11:25 AM
Car: 94 Acura GSR
Class : ITS
Spec Weight: 2690
Race Weight: 2730 (full tank, 55lbs ballast)
Driver weight: 185

------------------
Phil Phillips
94 Acura Integra GSR #4
ITS/H3/ST1
www.philstireservice.com
Amsoil Dealer
distributor for FireCharger AFFF fire systems
Hoosier Tire Dealer
Toyo Tire Dealer

philstireservice
11-28-2003, 11:29 AM
Car: 94 Acura GSR
Class: ITS
Spec Weight: 2690
Race Weight : 2730 (full tank, 55lbs ballast)
Driver Weight: 185


------------------
Phil Phillips
94 Acura Integra GSR #4
ITS/H3/ST1
www.philstireservice.com
Amsoil Dealer
distributor for FireCharger AFFF fire systems
Hoosier Tire Dealer
Toyo Tire Dealer

philstireservice
11-28-2003, 11:29 AM
Car: 94 Acura GSR
Class: ITS
Spec Weight: 2690
Race Weight : 2730 (full tank, 55lbs ballast)
Driver Weight: 185


------------------
Phil Phillips
94 Acura Integra GSR #4
ITS/H3/ST1
www.philstireservice.com
Amsoil Dealer
distributor for FireCharger AFFF fire systems
Hoosier Tire Dealer
Toyo Tire Dealer

philstireservice
11-28-2003, 05:51 PM
sorry....about the triple post. Server was very very very slow........

Jiveslug
12-10-2003, 04:12 PM
Well, I dont have a car (yet) but you guys make ME feel heavy! Sheesh. Im only 5'10 and weigh 250lbs. I dont think I could lose more than 30 or 35 even if I did an impersonation of Ghandi. Now Im looking at the spread sheet seeing which car can handle my heavy a$$. http://Forums.ImprovedTouring.com/it/tongue.gif

Banzai240
12-10-2003, 04:55 PM
I have an updated verson of this spreadsheet ready... I'll try to get it posted this evening.

Basic conclusion.... The majority of cars are fine with < 100lbs of ballast, and in fact are too heavy now...

I'm going to look into it further to get a feel for just how much a maximum ballast rule would have to be to take into consideration most cases... Those that fall outside the current maximum, however, well... No one said you HAD to remove the AC system, passenger seat, etc... http://Forums.ImprovedTouring.com/it/wink.gif

More to come...

------------------
Darin E. Jordan
SCCA #273080, OR/NW Regions
Auburn, WA
ITS '97 240SX
http://home.comcast.net/~djjordan/Web/DJ_AV1.jpg

rockfan4
12-10-2003, 10:20 PM
OK, I've got to throw this one in there. Back around '91-'92, I had a Rabbit GTI. ITA back then. Didn't do much to lighten the car, just removed the carpet, undercoating, rear seat. Back then you couldn't remove the passenger seat or headliner. Got to the track, ran it through the scales, and I was over 100 lbs underweight. Ran off to the Farm and Fleet, bought 2 50lb boxes of nails, and some bolts to bolt the spare tire back in. Stuffed the boxes under the seats, I really hate to think what would have happened if I rolled it! "Fixed" it before the next race, remember this was before ballast. Never understood why the Rabbit Gti had to weigh 130 lbs more than the standard 1.7 rabbit.

Banzai240
12-11-2003, 01:27 AM
OK guys and gals... here is the most recent version of the spreadsheet... Make of it what you will. (Same link as before...)

IT Minimum Weights Spreadsheet, Dec. 10, 2003 (http://home.comcast.net/~djjordan/Web/SCCA/IT_Min_Weights.xls)
Thanks for all the input!

------------------
Darin E. Jordan
SCCA #273080, OR/NW Regions
Auburn, WA
ITS '97 240SX
http://home.comcast.net/~djjordan/Web/DJ_AV1.jpg



[This message has been edited by Banzai240 (edited December 11, 2003).]

Eric Parham
12-11-2003, 06:27 PM
Car: 83 VW Scirocco
Class: ITB
Min. Spec Weight: 2270
Race Weight before fix: 2051 (full wet, 1911 lb car plus 140 lb driver)
Race Weight after fix: 2310 (full wet with driver and 100lbs ballast in passenger footwell)
Driver Weight: 140

[This message has been edited by Eric Parham (edited December 11, 2003).]

Eric Parham
12-11-2003, 06:40 PM
Darin,
By asking for only one "race weight", the results may overlook the fact that many vastly underweight cars have already been "fixed". Perhaps you should also ask for any "fixing weight" added, such as 150 lb fire extinguishers and the like, and constuctively add that to the "ballast" (even though we can't admit that it *is* ballast).
-Eric

[This message has been edited by Eric Parham (edited December 11, 2003).]

Eric Parham
12-11-2003, 06:45 PM
oops, tried to delete duplicate post but not authorized...


[This message has been edited by Eric Parham (edited December 11, 2003).]

TBreu007
12-16-2003, 04:14 PM
edit: duplicate

[This message has been edited by TBreu007 (edited December 17, 2003).]

TBreu007
12-16-2003, 04:30 PM
Vehicle Year/Make/Model: 1992 Nissan 240sx
IT Class: ITS
Classification Weight: 2650
Actual, unballasted race-prepped weight w/ driver: 2615 w/almost empty tank
Driver weight: 165lbs

Car is fully stripped to the letter of the law and has a massive cage.

Banzai240
12-16-2003, 04:39 PM
Originally posted by TBreu007:
Vehicle Year/Make/Model: 1992 Nissan 240sx
IT Class: ITS

Thank you! I was waiting for one of these to be listed! I've inserted it into the spreadsheet and will post the revised version shortly...



------------------
Darin E. Jordan
SCCA #273080, OR/NW Regions
Auburn, WA
ITS '97 240SX
http://home.comcast.net/~djjordan/Web/DJ_AV1.jpg

RacerBowie
12-16-2003, 08:37 PM
ITA Miata '93

Spec weight: 2205
Actual weight: 2230 (last race)
Driver weight: 195

Car is losing 15-20 lbs over the offseason, driver is losing 25

Ony, it is possible to get a miata to minimum, just keep on gutting. This car still has all of it's undercoating.

Bowie

[This message has been edited by RacerBowie (edited December 16, 2003).]

88YB1
12-24-2003, 01:29 PM
Car: 86 Pontiac Fiero SE
Class: ITA
Spec weight: 2560
Race weight: 2730 (1/4 tank)
Driver Weight: 210 and losing.
Every legal component removed.

Chuck Willyard
Atlanta region

itafiero
05-02-2004, 05:42 PM
Originally posted by 88YB1:
Car: 86 Pontiac Fiero SE
Class: ITA
Spec weight: 2560
Race weight: 2730 (1/4 tank)
Driver Weight: 210 and losing.
Every legal component removed.

Chuck Willyard
Atlanta region

'88 looking to run at 2600 ;-)

DENIS SCHEMBRI
05-02-2004, 11:39 PM
1985 DODGE CHARGER
IT-B
2320 MIN WT
2370 RACE WT
165 DRIVER WT
RACE WEIGHT IS WITH 25 LBS BALLEST AND FULL FUEL LOAD ( 8 GALLONS )

shwah
05-03-2004, 03:35 PM
1986 VW Golf ITB
2280 min weight
2292 race weight
180 driver weight
power Recaro passenger seat
spare tire
very full gas tank

Chris

Mark LaBarre
05-12-2004, 10:26 AM
1986 Volkswagen Scirocco
ITB
spec weight 2240(? I believe)
150# driver
running a lot of extra tubes in the cage, 100# balast, spare tire, passenger seat, 10# halon, full undercoating and minimum of 1/2 tank gas to make weight.

JeffYoung
05-12-2004, 10:53 AM
1980 ITS TR8
Spec weight: 2560
Race weight with 1/2 tank of fuel + camera:
2610
Driver: 180

There's some lightening to be done. I could easily get to 2560.

Hotshoe
05-16-2004, 01:05 AM
1984 Mazda RX7
Class: ITA / IT7
Dry Weight W/Driver: 2450
Spec Weight: 2380
Driver Weight: 225

dyoungre
05-17-2004, 10:51 AM
1980 Mazda RX7
Class: ITA / IT7
Dry Weight W/Driver: 2395
Spec Weight: 2380
Driver Weight: 180

Dry weight includes at least 5 gallons of fuel, as I defined it as 'required' when I (ahem) was more svelt. Time to admit that I don't need as much fuel ballast anymore!

------------------
Dave Youngren
NER ITA RX7 #61

anthonywill3
01-02-2005, 01:00 PM
Originally posted by mlytle:
Vehicle: 1988 BMW 325is
Class: ITS
Classification weight: 2750
Actual weight: 2460 (7/8ths tank of gas)
Driver Weight: 195
Ballast Weight: 95

very easy to make these cars light. i have to start a sprint race with a full tank of gas to make min weight in impound.

marshall

Hey Marshall:
I know this is an old post, can you email me what you did to get to that minimum weight?
Thanks!
Tony Williams, you ITS "Student"

BVinson
01-05-2005, 10:37 AM
ITS
1998 Acura Integra GSR
spec=2690
actual=2390
driver=175

SamITC85
01-05-2005, 11:44 AM
My old ITC Rabbit:
Spec Weight: 2000
Actual Weight: 1850
Driver Weight: 135
I had to race with a full tank of gas to finish with enough gas to make it so I was above weight.


------------------
Sam Rolfe
TBR Motorsports
#85 ITC VW Rabbit being converted to LPHP
#85 GP Scirocco

Jiveslug
01-07-2005, 01:43 PM
Hey Darin. I would like to submit the idea of bringing the weight down of cars that are too heavy for their class. For example, I was looking at the 86-89 Celica GTS and they are over 2600 lbs. at 135hp. If we look at the current top runners in ITA, all have a power to weight in the neighborhood of 19-17. If we could shave 100-150lbs off a lot of cars, then we would open up the class so its not a Honda vs. Nissan thing. Is that being looked at? I use the Celica as an example because they are common, have some aftermarket support, and are very durable. What do you think?

Ryan

zracre
01-09-2005, 08:23 PM
1992 Acura Integra ITA
min weight 2480#
weight with driver: 2523
35# ballast
3 gal of gas in tank
driver 165#
be warned one track scale varies from another track scale...i have found up to 30# difference with the exact same amount of gas.
and the same scale at daytona read different 2 times in a row!!

rcr510
01-10-2005, 11:27 AM
1971 Datsun 510 - ITC
Spec: 2170
Actual: 2225 (w/ about 1 gal gas, 0 ballast)
Driver 200

Nigel Stu
01-10-2005, 01:52 PM
1971 Datsun 510
ITC
2170 spec
2150 - with driver/gear, about 1 gal of gas and my tow bar installed instead of the FR bumper. No ballast
Driver 140